 June 24, 2016 - 10:52pm | I'm making a 3D model of the laser pistol in the Alpha Dawn basic rule book. There appears to be a switch at the top of the grip where the thumb could slide it towards the trigger. I believe this is the safety switch. To the right of this switch is another possible switch or lever at the top of the grip and just under the round knobby thing at the back of the gun. What is this thing / lever / switch? Also where is the SEU clip on thus gun? Is it the long round knobby thing at the back of the gun? How does one adjust the SEU setting on the gun? What other features and components do you guys see in the drawing of the laser pistol? -iggy |
 June 24, 2016 - 11:23pm |  If this is the pistol you are referring to...I'd say the slider behind the trigger would be the power setting as it is an awkward location for a safety. I would figure the safety would be the blacked out area above the trigger, as it would have to be an ambidextrous setting so it could be utilized equally via either hand/on either side of the gun. I've always thought of the "knob" at the rear to be a counter weight for balance, i.e. to prevent the pistol from being front-heavy. I would guess the powerclip is a slanted design, akin to the sloppy rendering of the KE-1500 version in Zeb's Guide. The latch behind the grip would be the release, pulling on it (i.e. toward the knob/away from the grip) would open the grip cover at the bottom and simultaneously eject the spent powerclip, sliding a fresh clip in would reset that latch and the grip cap can be snapped shut once the clip is seated. These design cues carry over to the rifle as well, with a longer throw on the grip slider to reflect the higher settings that are possible on the rifle.  |
 June 25, 2016 - 9:35am | if the bit behind the trigger is a power setting slider, where's the safety? I think the round bit (not the knob) is the receiver retaining pin. At least on the pistol, I think the knob is the power setting (twist to set). The magazine release is built into the powerclip, which catches on the lip of the magwell in the grip. I've seen that design plenty of times. |
June 25, 2016 - 10:09am | if the bit behind the trigger is a power setting slider, where's the safety?
Like I said, the blacked out area above the trigger guard, it could be a slider that goes up and down on both sides. |
June 25, 2016 - 11:24am | I've been away from my PC for the past few days without internet for my PC so I'm posting from my phone or I would post a picture with each feature color coded. Yes this is the pistol and rifle I'm talking about. -iggy |
June 25, 2016 - 11:30am | Pulling on the lever behind the grip is a two hand operation that leaves no hand free to catch the spent clip. This feature is in such an awkward position I'm puzzled about what it would be. -iggy |
June 25, 2016 - 12:40pm | In a fight, you don't have time to catch spent clips. In the case of SEU clips, it doesn't matter anyway since they're not rechargable. |
June 25, 2016 - 12:48pm | Removal of a clip should be one handed so the other hand can be ready with the replacement. -iggy |
June 25, 2016 - 12:57pm | Upon consideration, I think the bit at the back is the mag release. Feels more ergonomic. |
 June 25, 2016 - 1:12pm | In a fight, you don't have time to catch spent clips. In the case of SEU clips, it doesn't matter anyway since they're not rechargable.
Wrong Wrong Wrong. Soldiers are taught to exchange magazines and not drop the empties. You reuse them so you don't just drop them and hope to find them later. BTW soldiers are also taught to exchange magazines before they are empty. That way you don't run out at an inconvient time. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
 June 25, 2016 - 1:19pm | I thought SEU clips were rechargable. Anyway, I think the SF art was done for stylistic purposes much like some concept cars rather than for a practical manufacturing/everyday use purposes. Joe Cabadas |
June 25, 2016 - 1:35pm | In a fight, you don't have time to catch spent clips. In the case of SEU clips, it doesn't matter anyway since they're not rechargable.
Depending on your situation you do not want to just drop clips. Evidence pops to mind. Also military trained people are taught not to drop their clips. You do not want to leave things for the enemy to use. Use of an empty SEU clip? IED. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
June 25, 2016 - 3:08pm | If the slider above the grip is a safety think how awkward it will be to activate, you would physically have to release your grip on the pistol in order to activate it or use the off hand. Either way it's a poor location for a safety. Being in such an awkward location, it makes more sense as a power selector, since it isn't going to be utilized as frequently as a safety would. |
June 25, 2016 - 3:59pm | Assuming it's a slider and not the pivot point. Take a look at this layout (Thompson SMG) http://www.rockislandauction.com/photos/62/p_standard/AVN7-K-CU1-L.jpg note the safety at the rear. looks just the same. And no, SEU clips can not be recharged. Bulletclips can't be refilled either. They're disposable. |
June 25, 2016 - 4:07pm | Well I'll be... That's what I get for being a revolver guy. We don't need no steenking safeties.  |
June 25, 2016 - 5:52pm | Here's another idea: Frontier weapons are supposed to be universally made to fit the hands -- do Dralasites technically have hands? -- of the Core Four races. Maybe the sliders and stuff are there to convert the grip to other configurations, such as fitting the Vrusk's hand. Joe Cabadas |
June 25, 2016 - 9:01pm | Many of the canon vrusk pics with weapons depict them with bulb-like handles, similar to that of a child's bicycle horn.  |
June 25, 2016 - 10:21pm | OK, here is a picture of the parts I am describing, just to be clear, though everyone seems to be clear. First, this is a human/yazirian weapon. Dralasites could use it easily, but vrusk would not find it comfortable. I've been looking more at this image after reading all the posts. Yes this was done for art reasons and function was not well thought out. However, I would like to give plausible functions to the colored items above and then I'll add other features to the 3D model that meet real world functional needs and make them blend with the art above. I see the light blue as the exposed portion of the SEU clip. This is also where you would plug in the cord for a belt/back pack. Any other place would make the weapon cumbersome. The green slider button that I imagine sliding in the dark green slot is what I had thought of as the safety when I was a kid, but that does not jive with my adult experience. I would have to pull my thumb away from the grip (effectivly two handing the weapon) to slide this switch. Thus I do not see this as the safety or the SEU clip release. I wonder if this is the SEU level control. However, 20 positions on this tiny of a slider is problematic to acurately set. Unless the slider is a bump switch. The function could be like this; The switch normally resides in the middle and can be bumped forward or back and it will spring back to the middle. One bump with the thumb and it increments or decrements the SEU level by one and the switch springs back. Holding the switch forward or back starts the switch counting up or down. The switch can be pushed in while in the forward, middle, or back positions to lock the SEU at 20, user choice, or 1 SEU level respectively. The yellow feature bugs me. I had ignored it as a kid but I don't see a good reason for it to be there now. I see it as rubbing my hand at the back where my thumb and wrist meet. So, I want to come up with a plausable function or reason for this to be in the art. The red circle is the location I am thinking ShadowShack is placing the safety. Note, this is not depicted in the laser rifle art, but that does not mean it is not there. The round knob at the back of the pistol that is replaced with the stock on the rifle is a mystery. I don't see it as a counter balance. This could be a screw off cap to get at the laser optics, crystal, and laser pump source (diode, flash lamp, new fangled source). On the rifle this would be inside the arm reaching back to the shoulder stock. I see the front sight as ChrisDonovan sees it. I puzzle over the flash hider that ChrisDonovan marked. The laser will get hot. I built opthalmic lasers for four years and managing the heat was a big part of our design work. However, there is no gas discharge or other bright material that would flash and need to be hid. Also, the laser beam is columnated so there is no off axis light to see. However, because it so obviously looks like a muzzle break I suppose it could be explained that the cooling system of the weapon forces hot air from the laser cavity forward along the barrel to discharge it away from the user and his hand. However this would cause a problem for use in a vacuum. If the laser is air cooled then use in a vacuum would be limited. The laser cavity would over heat faster in a vacuum that in an atmosphere. I want a better explaination than this. I'll keep thinking on it. I agree that vrusk pistols have a different hand grip. I see the grip, the lower, and the upper coming off of the laser cavity and barrel and another grip being placed over it. In fact, looking at image of the core four party sneaking up on a bad guy and I can image the knob on the back of the laser pistol is the far end of the laser cavity and the muzzle break is the other. The vrusk is holding the exact same laser cavity but with a bulb grip attached over the lnob end of the cavity. Yet, where does the clip go in the vrusk version? I would like to hear some of everyone elses thoughts. -iggy |
June 25, 2016 - 11:57pm | However, 20 positions on this tiny of a slider is problematic to acurately set. Unless the slider is a bump switch. Don't forget the pistol only has ten settings, the rifle has 20...hence the longer throw on the rifle slider. The red circle is the location I am thinking ShadowShack is placing the safety. Note, this is not depicted in the laser rifle art, but that does not mean it is not there. Yep. A common artistic trick to "lazily not bother with details" is to completely black something out. ;) Either way, the blacked out portion could be the power setting as the slider is a safety...but I still feel it would be an awkward maneuver to move a thumb to that grip slider versus above the trigger. As mentioned, being a revolver guy it's been far too long since I fingered a safety. |
June 26, 2016 - 7:15am | Well I'll be... That's what I get for being a revolver guy. We don't need no steenking safeties. And the positioning on the left side is right where it would be if the weapon is configured for a right-handed shooter (operates via the grip hand thumb). I would expect to see the same thing on the other side (ambidextrous safety). Here's the modern version (H&K UMP) in the same basic position. http://modernrifleman.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/dsc_0754.jpg What are you shooting, anyway? I know safties are kind'a rare on revolvers, but they're not unheard of. http://www.forgottenweapons.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/safety.jpg |
June 26, 2016 - 7:43am | @ Iggy: The safety is right at the top of the grip where it should be, and where it is on all modern firearms. The Frontier version would probably be ambedextrous (meaning mirrored on the other side). All you do is lift the thumb slightly and flick it between Fire and Safe. THat does not make it a two-hand operation. I dismiss the black area as a potential safety due to improper ergonomics. A flash hider would still be necessary because of spill/refracted light at the point of emission. Next (and final) pass at a layout:  |
June 26, 2016 - 9:08am | What are you shooting, anyway? I know safties are kind'a rare on revolvers, but they're not unheard of. I have a collection of single and double action Rugers and S&Ws in various barrel lengths and calibers. |
June 26, 2016 - 11:07am | Interesting. I know on single-actions safeties are very rare due to the single-action mechanism serving much the same function. They're more common on double-actions but still not universal as on semi-automatics. |
June 26, 2016 - 2:47pm | Both Ruger and S&W utilize a sliding device that covers the firing pin on their DA models, it engages if the trigger is not being pulled. In other words, if you accidentally pull the hammer back and let it drop without holding the tirgger, it will not fire. Naturally a SA by nature also will not fire unless you depress the trigger. Still, neither offers a method that allows you to pull the trigger and not have it fire (the same can be said with Glock self-loaders). Not the best images available but I found these:  |
June 26, 2016 - 4:53pm | Only one question. Why would a laser pistol need a flash hider? Lasers are either invisible to the naked eye or a colored beam if you are cinematic. Flash comes from the burning powder in slug throwers. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
June 29, 2016 - 7:58am | Laser flash can also come from radient scatter from the beam due to atmospheric conditions. For a show that otherwise basically ignores science, the original BSG got a few things close to right. |
June 29, 2016 - 10:16am | That's just techno bable. What's next the nabual crystal is coefficient to the adjacent light matrix causing disassociate scatter. By the way, the proper term is flash suppressor. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
June 29, 2016 - 1:21pm | No, it's not "just technobabble". Look at laser sights in any environment where there is atmospheric contamination (smoke, dust, fog, etc). "Flash hider", btw, is listed as a valid alternate name in most definitions. |
 June 29, 2016 - 2:46pm | So bottom line? Are we saying that a laser can be fired by just touching the trigger or that maybe it's like the "safety on many power too L s these days? I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 29, 2016 - 6:46pm | Rattraveller is right. There is no functional use for a flash hider on a laser. The scattering of light you mention from fog, dust, etc. will just exist at the exit of the flash hider and continue the length of the beam. A laser does not discharge gass nor is the light spreading as it comes out of the laser cavity window. The beam of light is columnated so there are no incident rays in any other direction than straight out toward the target. The diffusion angles of lasers are across such large distances that the angle from the source is essentially zero. I see the inclusion of a muzzle break on this as a liberty of the artist and not a specification from an experienced engineer desiging lasers. The community at large is used to seeing cool shapes at the end of weapon barrels so the designers have done this to meet public expectations. I would use these extra features to my advantage and dress up a heat sink to look like a flash supressor and to keep keep people from putting fingerprints and dirt on the laser cavity window. I want the laser cavity window as clean as possible so that the highest amount of laser energy is passed through it. Also any dirt on the window is going to get cooked onto the window over repeated use. The decorative flash suppressor can also seal the laser cavity window with a cheap secondary window that is disposable inside the flash suppressor decoration. Back to the safety on the weapon. I do not see this weapon as having additional safeties like contemporary power tools. The safety in the laser pistol and rifle artwork is half and inch to and inch too low. Where it is at now it is inside the grip of the user roughly right behind the thumb knuckle. I was searching for another explaination for the switch in this location but I may not find something plausible. I'm trying to make the 3D model true to the art but I may have to correct such egegious mistakes. The feature above the grip in the back that I colored yellow may not be a switch at all. This could be part of the grip added by the PGC graphics design team to improve the look of the industrial design. No function but style. -iggy |
June 30, 2016 - 11:23am | So bottom line? Are we saying that a laser can be fired by just touching the trigger or that maybe it's like the "safety on many power too L s these days? I don't know how those work. As for the laser, my suupsition would be that it cuts a critical path between the powerpack and the lasing mechanism so that it wouldn't go off in the event the trigger were either jostled or accidently pulled of if the weapon were dropped and the circuits accidently engaged. |
