 November 7, 2014 - 4:46pm | Two peices of equipment which often interchangable in Sci-fi stories, the scanner and sensor. Here is my attempt to clarify the difference between the two. Scanner: This came from Star Trek but I did two
important things. I limited their range
and their scope of detection. I then
divided them into three classes: Multiscanner, Maintenance and Medical
scanner. The device also uses a computer
program to do an analysis what the person was reading on his screen. The best
way to look at Scanners is how a CAT scan works. The following is a general
description of what a scanner can do. Range
and Motion Detection: The scanner can
detect whether or not an object is moving or stationary. It can also give you the range to the object. Power
Source: This function allows the operator to see what sort of power an object
is using. It can detect fire, internal
combustion engines, atomic power, electricity, and fusion reactors. Depending on the power source, even the hand
held deceive can detect a source at a great distance. Physical Structure: The device can analyze any physical object within its range. Detail scans are done at close range. At medium and long range, an operator can tell
the difference between a rock, building or starship. At close and short range, he can tell you
what the molecular structure is.
Life Type: The scanner can discern between
plants and animals at long range. At
close range (100 meters or less) they can determine if a life form is a
reptile, mammal, bacteria, etc. More
detail information is gained by use of a medical scanner. Range
for these devices run from 100 meters to 1 AU.
The greater the distance causes a time lag between the scanner and the
information. There are two modes for a
Scanner: Active and Passives. Active is
where the operator sends out a beam to scan an object while Passives use
naturally occurring background particles to pass through an object to collect
information on the target. Active can be
detected by another ship while passives cannot.
The downside to Passive scanners is there is a considerable time lag
between detection and getting a reading due to the realistic nature of normal
space. Medical
and Maintenance are used at Point blank range (10 meters or less). These specialized scanners are intended to
aide in the diagnostic and detail study of an object. +30 to the operating the scanner in making a
diagnostic. Scanners
can be used by anyone but it takes a person with a Scanner Ops skill to ensure
a proper reading is derived from the device.
Otherwise, the person using the scanner must rely on the microcomputer
database and Predict program. Handheld
devices general come in two pieces: The Emitter and receiver and power
pack/computer housing. They are connected by a cord. Early models are the size
of a back pack, at higher Tech Level the device is merged into a single
unit. There range is limited to 10 kilometers
but could detect a strong power source up to 100 kilometers away. Their programs are limited to Level 2. Vehicle
Based Scanners can have up to 100 kilometer range and limited to Level 4. Starship
Base Scanners have up to a 1 AU range and limited to Level 6. Scanner Ops skill is a level +10 on a die roll. Sensors:
You
have to think of sensors as a human’s five senses: Touch, taste, smell, seeing
and hearing. These are devices that for
the most part come in contact with an object.
They include: Atmospheric
detector, Radiation detector, audio detector, multi spectrum cameras, EMF
Detectors, Chemical detectors, motion detector, etc. Unlike a scanner, it doesn’t put out a beam
to gather information rather it samples the surrounding area (within 10 meters
of a person). Sensors can tell you the
direction something is moving or range through the use of optics, which way the
winds blowing, what is the light source being used or what is in the area
surrounding it and what chemicals are in the area. Sensors are usually
stationary for the best results. They
are used on probes to gather information about planets. Since sensors are a passive
device they can be placed anywhere and can be shield against detection. To gain the information from one of these
devices, a comlink or physical download must be made. |
 November 18, 2014 - 9:39am | i'm saying they would be designed TO be able to fool energy sensors... they would intentially imit heat to look like a atomic or chemical drive. You would probably have to buy your decoy in Ion, Atomic, or Chemical flavors. ----------------------------------------------- |
 November 18, 2014 - 10:32am | But the sensor would look for the overall heat silhouette, not just the engines. So it would look at a decoy and enable you to see that the silhouette is too small to be 'X' ship, and thus you can infer from that that it's a decoy. You'd have to make a decoy as big as the ship it's mimicking to get around this, which would be a waste of time. |
November 18, 2014 - 11:10am | Well... as writ... the energy sensors only pick up extreem heat/energy sources. As writ... the E.S. can't see ionic drives at all so it is very safe to assume they also can not see ship board power usage and heat dispersement. Only the high levels produced by the active atomic engine or chemical engine. I know your article is indicating that fact (that E.S. can only detect high levels) is silly limited. But for game-ability I like that limitation. One issue with any high tech/modern tech RPG is reality is unplayable. SOOOO... assuming all the other stuff in an Ion driven ship is invisible to an E.S., so to would all the other stuff in an atomic or chem ship. So... the E.S. would only pick up the heat/energy of the engines... and that would all that would need mimiced. Once you pick up the heat signature you then use your radar to identify the ship, which then the decoy fools with its magnetic siloette. PS. Let me know if i'm missing something from your article here. ----------------------------------------------- |
November 18, 2014 - 11:23am | Now to HiJACK this thread a little. How to you play/run sensors in game? Do you just make them always automatic or does a PC have to make a check of some kind like a logic check to opperate the sensors? I'm always looking for roles for the PC's to have active things to do. I am doing this thing where crew give each other bonuses... leadership can inspire and even medical can have previously done work to keep the crew health or help them not suffer from stressful situations. I have been doing it a little hap-hazard and plan to formalize the synergy bonus system somehow.... but somebody running the sensors could be giving the gunners bonuses in targeting maybe. I think i will work on my synergyt bonuses system and post it for review.... but back to the HiJack... do you have somebody make a roll to detect stuff using radar/E.S/Visual telescopes? Most likely this would be the astrogator. If you do, I would assume bonus and maybe penalties from range? Doing this might set up situation where from round to round you lose track of where a certain ship is. ----------------------------------------------- |
November 19, 2014 - 1:37am | SOOOO... assuming all the other stuff in an Ion driven ship is invisible to an E.S., so to would all the other stuff in an atomic or chem ship. So... the E.S. would only pick up the heat/energy of the engines... and that would all that would need mimiced. Once you pick up the heat signature you then use your radar to identify the ship, which then the decoy fools with its magnetic siloette. PS. Let me know if i'm missing something from your article here. The decoy would have to output the same power as the engines it's mimicking, and do this consistently over time. This would require the same engines as the ship it's mimicking, so is pretty much not doable. As writ, everything is not very believable even using 1979s/80s technology as a base so I put this down to the writers not knowing enough about the subject, or purposely putting in clunkiness to make the game work. Radar could not be spoofed by a decoy either. Radar would have to be jammed or have it's beam scattered by other means. |
 November 19, 2014 - 5:45am | Imagination VS Reality... It is always good to understand what can & can not be done per our current RL tech level & the science behind it, but then you must decide what sort of game are you running? Heavily Realistic (As much real science as possible) Medium Realistic (A fair amount of RL science) Light Realistic/TV Pulp Sci-fi (Plot driven devices with only a bit of RL science thrown in, laws of physics are flexible) Super Science (Science is Magic, and looks like Magic) Archaic Science Ideas & Sci-fi (Hollow Worlds, Humans on a verdant Venus, Astral Projection as a means of space travel, Burrough's style writing, people pass out when rocket blasts off, etc) In the end it is all Imagination vs Reality... Can they see lasers in space or not? The RL answer is no, the TV answer is usually yes. I still love old sci-fi I know is wrong... I love the Atomic Rocket site BTW.  "Never fire a laser at a mirror." |
November 19, 2014 - 10:44am | So do you guys/ladies have the PC roll something to operate the sensors? ----------------------------------------------- |
November 19, 2014 - 10:44am | So do you guys/ladies have the PC roll something to operate the sensors? ----------------------------------------------- |
 November 19, 2014 - 10:57am | So do you guys/ladies have the PC roll something to operate the sensors? sensors/scanners do what they do but PCs can try to fine tune the data which would be a skill check. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
November 19, 2014 - 11:48am | i am thinking a operator needs to focus the radar (or more likely some kind of lidar) at the object they think is interesting. That could miss from round to round maybe. I also wonder could clouds of dust interfer? I'm assuming a logic check probably. ----------------------------------------------- |
November 20, 2014 - 6:54am | i am thinking a operator needs to focus the radar (or more likely some kind of lidar) at the object they think is interesting. That could miss from round to round maybe. I also wonder could clouds of dust interfer? I'm assuming a logic check probably. actually dust clouds in space are not entirely like dust clouds on Earth. the particle concentration is space is rather low. so my guess is that in the real world no but for the game you could rule yes. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 November 20, 2014 - 3:12pm | Yeah, on small scales (and by this I mean astronomically small i.e < 100's of AU) with the exception of nebula in the final stages of collapse into stars, the particle density of dust and gas in space is less than the strongest vacuum we can produce on earth (there are more particles per cubic centimeter in the best vacuum on earth than in the nebula). So unless there is some strange anomoly increasing the density, they wouldn't have much effect at all. Ad Astra Per Ardua! My blog - Expanding Frontier Webmaster - The Star Frontiers Network & this site Founding Editor - The Frontier Explorer Magazine Managing Editor - The Star Frontiersman Magazine |
November 21, 2014 - 11:30am | The radar could do the focusing itself - or rather, would hand over tracking to the tagetting computer. In this manner it would be similar to TWS (track while scan) systems used in modern fighter aircraft. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_while_scan |
December 5, 2014 - 9:33pm | So.... decoys... are suppost to create a radar image of a ship using "magnetics". So I'm thinking this means that it creates a energy field in the shape of a ship structure... possibly sharing some tech from inertia fields. If a decoy can create something that causes the radar/lidar waves/beams to bounce back in the shape of something... couldn't the same tech also cloak or stealth a ship... just buy carefully bouncing the waves/beams away and not return them to the scans point of origin... much like modern stealth technology works. Like it could could create a magnetic shell around your ship with all the angles you see in a stealth fighter/bomber. Granted... Stealth aircraft tech was still SciFi for out games creators... much like the iphone was. That and I'm leaning heavily to the "radar" really being more like lidar which doesn't send out waves... so it would need forcused at a target little better I think to be able to desern a ship shape from an asteriod. ----------------------------------------------- |
