 July 25, 2014 - 9:36pm | We all know you're not suppose to talk politics and religeon in the star ship lounge; which is probably why little is known about the political factions and parties within the Frontier in general and the Council of Worlds in particular. Without a doubt many of the cadres represent special interest groups and their various agenda can emerge as hot button issues within the Frontier politica framework. Certianly corporate concerns enter into the political arena. Small colonies and large colonies have very different concerns. So what would the broad agendas and political platforms be in the Frontier? What issues like gun control raise their head repeatedly? Clarion has strick gun laws- but what about the presence of the nuclear torpedo within the KHs rules- some of the priveteers and yatchs were armed with this weapon so a SF political issue could easily be "star ship weapons control" Others? I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 July 26, 2014 - 6:28am | In my game the sale of assault rockets or torpedoes for civilian ships is illegal. Even the pirates tend to abide by the policy, at least on the torpedoes --- energy sensors can detect them and it disrupts their covert/corsair operations when they're easily detected. Players tend to not have any issues with this as civilian ships are severely undergunned as it stands, and the last thing they want is a weapon system that runs out of ammo in deep space leaving them unarmed. But if they happen to acquire them (from the few pirate ships that are willing to utilize said systems), more power to them...but they quickly realize that hunting down the ammo still makes them "inferior" systems. Of course the big political coup in my game is the upstart dictator that takes over the Frontier with the assistance of Streel and the Free Frontiersman Foundation, a parallel to the fall of the Old Republic in Star Wars. |
 July 28, 2014 - 12:59pm | I struggle with the nature of the UPF with this a little. The UPF is a confederation of the colonies... you would imagine there would be constant bickering between various colonies on hwo much they should have to pay to support the UPF fleet... Who enforces those payments? I would quickly see small colonies banding together as a sort of lobby to fight for the rich colonies to pay for almost all of the costs involved with space fleet while calling that "fair" while the rich colonies would have thier efforts toward making the UPF dues more evenly distributed in the name of being more "fair". SOOOOO... Is there supposed to be a frontier capital seat of UPF governement? Since each colony or planent is supposed to be completely autonomous only banded together for mutual protection from space fleet... each with its own potentially radically different local governements plenty of them would probably try to sessede from the UPF basically just to avoid paying the TAX they have to send to space fleet. Also you would just have a lot of "deadbeat" colonies that just have nto paid thier dues because they are poor. All that will create friction.... not to mention I expect even though the frontier is supposed to be all homogenous racially... there would still be racial issues that would creep up.... Yazierians and humans probably server in space fleet in a disproportion to the other races... so maybe they would want more say in things.... SLAVERY -- would totally happen in many of these planets... and there would be people in the frontier wanting to stamp that out. In my not yet off the ground game I'm rulling that the UPF offically considers slavery illegal but they only have juridiction on the space lanes.... so transporting slaves from planet to planet is forbidden but they can't stop the laws of a planet from allowing it... so of course you would have factions pushing for legalized transport of slaves either in mass, or just as personal staff. Lastly... I plan on having the UPF itself act to manipulate local governments either directly or with subterfuge. People would scream and yell about encrochment by "BIG SPACE FLEET". ----------------------------------------------- |
July 28, 2014 - 4:55pm | SLAVERY -- would totally happen in many of these planets... and there would be people in the frontier wanting to stamp that out. In my not yet off the ground game I'm rulling that the UPF offically considers slavery illegal but they only have juridiction on the space lanes.... so transporting slaves from planet to planet is forbidden but they can't stop the laws of a planet from allowing it... so of course you would have factions pushing for legalized transport of slaves either in mass, or just as personal staff.
A role that is readily acceptable for space pirates to improve their earnings. Sack a liner and sell the passengers off as slaves. Blackbeard's ship (Queen Anne's Revenge) was a former slave transport. A small liner could be easily upgunned by pirates and turned into a slave trader. Or perhaps even a captured troop transport. Push comes to shove, a small frieghter's hold can be turned into frozen class berth storage. Which brings up a fun deal from the Traveller game --- the captain takes bets from the crew as to how many frozen class passengers survive the journey, whoever guesses closest wins the pot. |
July 28, 2014 - 6:30pm | @ Abub you have a lot of good ideas. I think slavery is a going concern on Outreach (that should be frairly obvious) and indentured servitude is probably more wide spread than slavery, particularly on say a corporate world. What could be the ultimate "company town" than a corporate owned world like Exodus and Genesis in Pan-Gal, Corpco in New STreele, or Ringar in Solar Major. Cass in Devco, while a CDC planet is in my opinion a special case in that it was colonized with refugees from the Blue Plague and thus I think CDC is sensitive to perception and thus treads lightly actually finding that being the owner of the Frontier's newest Corporate planet a bit of a lemon instead of the prestige they thought it would be. To represent population size in the Council of Worlds I go with Hvy population worlds having 3 seats, Moderate having 2 seats and Light having 1 seat, outpost have too insignificant of a population or are too new to be an excepted member of the CoW. To give the government a little more depth there is a council of Species. With the core four as voting members, since Volturnus is a UPF territory (kind of like Peurto Rico) the Eorna have a none voting member on the Council of species and the Saurians have this as well at this point since they are newly come refugees just getting settled into Frontier society. This gives you a bicameral legislature. So breaking down Factions: Pro mega corp faction Colonies owned by mega corps are New Streel, Pan-Gal, Solar Major, and Devco. These give Streel, Pan Gal, CDC, and WarTech seats on the CoW that they dont have to pay for with cash which is a lot of power and is also the reason that I decided that the CoW could see they would lose control of their body to the megacorps so they enacted legislation that prevented mega corps from founding more colonies to pack the council and or to give right of self determination to the native populations of corporate planets after they reach a certian population level (moderate) but the four mentioned above are grandfathered in remain mega-corp planets. Any colony with a mega corp headquarters is potentially a strong member of this faction as the CoW reps are unlikely to vote for stuff that negatively impacts the economy back home but this is not absolute on a planet by planet basis. For example Hentz, while the headquarters of GodCo, is more concerned with its religious agenda and the mega corp is an expression of its own theology. Clarion, White Light has a more diversified economy and Eversafe is not quite the 900 lb. gorilla in the Clarion economy that say Streel is on Pale. Thus Pale, Clarion, Gran Quivera, Triad, Kdikit, Terledrom, Inner Reach, Scree Fron, Minotaur, Hargut, Lossend, and Hentz are simply potential supporters. Note that Triad has 3 mega corps head quartered there and Hargut has two so these planets will be mindful of mega corp issues as their economies are highly impacted by the mega corps. i get the impression that Triad mush have an environment that attracts corporations in general ie tax incentives. You then have planets dominated by mega corps but are not a straight up mega corp owned planet nor the headquarters for a mega corp of which Laco's World is the most famous example Farm Lobby All the worlds with ag economy could end up being a faction in support of legislation involing aggriculture issues. Many of these worlds have light population levels such that they will be a small voting block. Pro Weapons Lobby The pro-weapons lobby will be headed by colonies like Kdikit (Madderly's Star), Ringar (Solar Major), Outer Reach (Dramune), Hargut (Guna Garu) and potentially Pale (truane's star) and Corpco (New Streel). Kdikit is the home of MerCo. Ringar and Hargut are influenced by Wartech. Streel has a history of providing weapons to pawns for its own purposes so systems influenced by it are likely to be pro weapons. Weapons Control Clarion is famous for this and heads this lobby. No doubt the other heavy population planets support it to some degree and light population planet, particularly those with dangerous fauna do not. though since each planet runs its own internal thing so we're really talking about weapons being availabe for interstellar trade and such. Khs weapons available to the general public are the flip side of this issue and the supporters and detractors could shake out differently. Pro-Slavery Out Reach Dramune is an obvious candidate. there could be others but they would not want to appear to be in support of slavery so they would be careful about this issue Pro Space Fleet Any world that was Physically invaded by the sathar like Pale and Laco's World will hate the sathar. the UPF territory of Volturnus also will hate the sathar but having territory status and a UPF appointed governor means it doesn't vote on legislation. Moon World is a massive and supposedly secret military base - not even sure it has seats on the CoW but if it does then it would be pro Space Fleet. Inner Reach has been involved in 3 Dramune Wars and Space Fleet has had to intervene in at least one of them if not two so I can see them actually supporting a strong space fleet. Morgaine's world has a UPF space fortress and Space fleet's training academy so we can expect them to support a strong space fleet. Other worlds with a Space Fortress that might support a strong space fleet are Kdikit (Madderlys star), Pale (Truane Star), Clarion (White Light). Any system that has a sathar start circle in the campaign game which we can presume to have experienced numerous sathar incursions and this makes them potential supporters of a strong Space Fleet. The suarians are settling into Minotaur and Lossend and they hate the sathar with a passion so that can figure into wherther these colonies will support a strong space fleet. EDIT: the above is only a start on factions I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
July 28, 2014 - 7:05pm | RE: Slavery Terledrom controls Zik-kit (Kisk-Kar) as a mining colony (see the planetary footnote in AD not Zebs). its the only situation like that in the Frontier and probably a situation that predates first contact between humanity and the vrusk. Zik-kit could be a situation where the vrusk trade house or conglomerate involved is raising vrusk workers in virtual slavery. so Zik-kit might not have a seat on the CoW since its controlled from Terledrom. Terledrom has a government made up of elected dralasites and vrusk company reps. Philosophical Dralasites are not likely to want to support slavery but the company reps will so slavery issues could be a real can of worms for the delegates from Terledrom in the CoW. Groth in the Fromeltar system is light population dralasite colony, perhaps this colony might be a source of philosophical opposition to the virtual slavery going on in Zik-kit. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 May 10, 2016 - 8:12pm | This is an interesting discussion too. I'm making note of it. Joe Cabadas |
May 11, 2016 - 8:25am | Based on my appraisal of slavery and politics in the Zik-Kit and Terledrom system you could have the beginnings of a Dramune Run style adventure involving a stowaway that sneaks abourd ship at Zik-Kit. If PC choose to help the stowaway which could be based on purely a moral plea for help or based on a promise of reward of some sort. PCs must Dodge Terledrom and Zik-Kit militia. Forced to land at Groth for sanctuary the must eventually run the gauntlet in Fromeltar. Working title: Stowaway Run, or Cassidine Run I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 May 11, 2016 - 9:30am | I believe you are not using cultural bias in this discussion. While Dralasites are the ultimate individuals willing to debate all subjects Vrusk are by their nature predisposed to slavery. Vrusk are born into a Trade House and the Trade House makes all decisions for the Vrusk including who they marry which is code for who they Breed with. Since this is their norm trying to impose other races ideas of personal freedom on them would be very impolite. The Dralasites of that world and perhaps the CoW have all accepted this and do not push the issue. Use the 2nd Continental Congress as a basis. We really do not know how hard the non slave States fought the slave States on the issue. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
 May 13, 2016 - 6:48am | Minor historical note, not SF: Slavery was legal in every one of the Thirteen Colonies in 1775. There were no "non-slave states" at the Second Continental Congress. But it was less important across the northern colonies, and abolitionist (mainly gradual, not radical and immediate) groups were forming and gaining influence. |
May 13, 2016 - 6:46am | The point made by Rattraveller still makes sense to me. The historical bit isn't vital. |
May 13, 2016 - 8:18am | Yes I did forget that part about slavery being legal in all the colonies and Britain and Canada and the Caribean colonies in 1775. Economically it wasn't as important in the Northern areas then the Southern ones. BUT another form of slavery; Indentured Servitude was more common in the Northern states. For SF may need to come up with a Star Law definition of slavery since while some beings see no difference between Vrusk Trade Houses and the Red Devil Pirates others do. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
May 13, 2016 - 11:40am | Slavery would be a planetary issue in my Frontier, because the UPF is not an interstellar state but an alliance. Star Law would be concerned only with trafficking of intelligent beings between worlds/ systems, blackbirding, etc, as species of piracy. One planet might have indenture. Another slavery. Another only " free labor." |
May 13, 2016 - 11:43am | Slavery was legal in every one of the Thirteen Colonies in 1775. There were no "non-slave states" at the Second Continental Congress.
But it was less important across the northern colonies, and abolitionist (mainly gradual, not radical and immediate) groups were forming and gaining influence. Slavery was also legal in the northern states. Of noteworthy historical mention: the south was already working on disbanding slavery before the war started, meanwhile the north waited until after the war was over to do the same. Despite being universally hailed as the one who made it end, Lincoln was the biggest fence straddler on the issue. |
May 13, 2016 - 11:46am | I doubt many slaves exist outside specialized roles like prostitution, gladiatorial combat, and so on. Robot workers are probably more affordable and less troublesome given the tech level that seems to prevail in the published stuff. Isolated and primitive worlds may be another matter. It would be interesting to see a fairly high tech slave society on one world. Have you read " A Slave is a Slave"?( H Beam Piper) |
May 13, 2016 - 12:04pm | Maybe level 6 robots are considered people by some radicals? Or even by a planetary government? This could be a political and economic issue. |
 May 13, 2016 - 9:33pm | I believe you are not using cultural bias in this discussion. While Dralasites are the ultimate individuals willing to debate all subjects Vrusk are by their nature predisposed to slavery. Vrusk are born into a Trade House and the Trade House makes all decisions for the Vrusk including who they marry which is code for who they Breed with. Since this is their norm trying to impose other races ideas of personal freedom on them would be very impolite. The Dralasites of that world and perhaps the CoW have all accepted this and do not push the issue. Use the 2nd Continental Congress as a basis. We really do not know how hard the non slave States fought the slave States on the issue. I don't think it's fair to accuse Vrusk of being "predisposed to slavery". Vrusk are by nature communal insectoids. They may have a tendency to place the group over the individual, but that doesn't necessarily connote a master/slave relationship. |
May 13, 2016 - 9:43pm | Maybe level 6 robots are considered people by some radicals? Perhaps by those who pimp their pleasure-bots. Those technically fall into the "service" robot category, which can go to lv-6.  |
May 13, 2016 - 10:42pm | And where do Sapes fit into the picture? Remember the Great Sape Project to free the sapes from Yazarian oppression! Joe Cabadas |
May 14, 2016 - 7:56pm | I don't know, but I do like the Sapes and the idea that somebody out there if fighting for Sape rights. It's a fun political conflict. Maybe a robotics manufacturer is actually underwriting Sape Rights activism, for pecuniary reasons. |
May 15, 2016 - 1:56pm | Sape rights versus patent, trademark, and copyright is an age old battle. Much depends on the general feeling within a society. Try reading an issue of PETAs magazine and their struggle for animal rights, ya lousy meat eaters. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
May 15, 2016 - 4:02pm | The whole "sape" issue becomes much more current and topical with news that Harvard Univesity just got caught planning to create an entirely synthetic person from the DNA up. |
May 15, 2016 - 4:26pm | He say you dangerous man. He say you BrradeRunnah. |
May 16, 2016 - 11:52am | Ah they met to discuss the possibility of creating a synthetic human genome. Think we are a few decades away from People for the Ethical Treatment of Sapes. The Human Genome project was in its infancy when SF came out. Cloning and artificial life are mentioned in the game and Sapes but how far you take the technology in your game is up to you. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
