 January 21, 2011 - 9:39pm | With the sathar desirous to capture and examine an assault scout, witnessed in the famous incident with the Osprey and the sathar agent, Lt. Klast, why hasn't the sathar captured a pirate assault scout? And why haven't they just supplied one of their agents with the material to sell for enough credits to buy the tech they want to get their tentacles on? It would be simple and easy to do. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 January 21, 2011 - 10:15pm | I dont think its a matter of the Sathar's need to get their hands on the UPF's assault scout. They have created their own scout ship as seen in one of the modules. Lt. Kasts desire to obtain an assault scout may have been for covert reasons. I don't believe that the assault scout fits the Sathar's military doctrine of conquest and subjugation. The UPF use them primarily for a protective doctrine because of their jump capabilities, law enforcement applications, and defensive capabilities (Yes it doesnt pack a huge punch but in small engagements it can be more than adequette). |
 January 22, 2011 - 2:22am | Department of Corrections - Lt. Rhanda Klast was not the sathar agent, it was her C.O., Lt. Maxxer Tabbe That said, I don't see the need for the worms to have such a craft either. Not so much as having their own scout ship (which was in the Beyond the Frontier trilogy), as that was more of a scientific/exploration vessel (or "civilian" ship per se)...but without a carrier big enough to transport such ships it would only hinder their advancement into the Frontier. Let's face it, their worlds are unknown to the UPF, exactly how many jumps does it take them just to get into the Frontier to begin with? And then having to stop after every jump for the A-drives to get overhauled? That or simply leave them behind, a very likely thing for the worms to do --- which further disproves their need for the craft. It just seems to me the worms would eventually grow impatient with the maintenance heavy assault scouts and enter the Frontier without them, making the need for those scouts completely moot. |
 January 22, 2011 - 5:48am | Assumptions you know where they get you. The Frontier only sees the Sathar has attacking fiends and admits to having no idea what their homeworlds are like. SO the Sathar could have a very pressing need for a system defense boat in their home systems and the Frontier would not know it. Why they just don't buy one or take a pirate one. The Sathar agency in charge of acquiring one had its budget cut and could not afford to buy one or take a pirate out of service so they decided to steal one. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
January 22, 2011 - 7:46am | Why steal one when you have the scientific ability to make your own. Sathar agents have been around UPF Assault Scouts long enough at stations and construction sites to be able to gleen the necessary tech to build a similar model. I just think the authors didnt include it because it doesnt fit the Sathar military doctrine. Same goes for Battleships, Im sure the Sathar could build one but whats the point of building one battleship when you could build a couple destroyers with the same resources. |
 January 22, 2011 - 9:59am | The only sathar "attack for tech" is when they attempted to steal the XV-I from the belly of the Prachil Star. Ares #15 - Into the Void I'm not confident that sathar would be interested in the AS sized vessel unless it could be docked to a carrier for transport and dropped in-system. |
 January 22, 2011 - 10:13am | Perhaps the Sathar want the assault scout design not because they want to build their own, but because of the old saying "Know thy enemy." If the UPF makes use of these little annoyances, the Sathar would need to know why, and how to neutralize them without expending too many resources in doing so. The one big advantage the UPF has over the Sathar is that they have the home field advantage. Sathar must expend resources in creating supply lines to support the war effort, and so each of their assets on the battlefield must be used to its best effect, and wasting resources destroying Assault scouts isn't practical when the Sathar should be concentrating on bigger targets. The Sathar were trying to establish a foothold in Frontier space in the beyond the Frontier modules which if sucessful would have greatly aided them in their war effort, because it would have eliminated the need for Sathar ships to travel far from the warzone to rearm and resupply. this might mean that the Sathar may be ready to take the war to the next level, from raids to long term warfare, which is a scary thought. Anyway that's the opinion of a non-military stratagist, so those of us here with military backgrounds can laugh at my accessment. "Hey guys I wonder what this does"-Famous last words "Hey guys, I think it's friendly." -Famous last words "You go on ahead, I'll catch up." -Famous last words "Did you here that?" -Famous last words |
 January 22, 2011 - 8:45pm | Those are my thoughts as well Deryn. The Sathar don't want to know how to build assault scouts they want to know how to beat them, find all thier weakness' and flaws and exploit them. The fact that they caan only jump once safely might be well known but when they don't have to jump any where that's of little use to know. Or maybe the Sathar might want them for their own planetary defenses, which they may or may not be too concerned about. Now unless the Sathar want something like an assault scout as a disposable jump capable troop shuttle it might work for them, but at what cost? Do they have plenty of resources that twin atomic drives can be used and dumped in such a way? Would the Sathar want such a thing? In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same. |
January 23, 2011 - 7:45am | Well whether you want to discount the sathar desire to steal an assualt scout or not it is Frontier History and the operative question is WHY? IIRC in the Osprey incident the module suggested that the ship design was cutting edge and that the sathar were after it to unravel its secrets. I agree that they wouldn't want the design for the purpose of fielding their own but for the purpose of discovering its weaknesses. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 January 23, 2011 - 10:56am | If we discount the module as written, another possibility exists: Tabbe and his wormy masters(possibly with the aid of Streel and what remains of the Planarion pirates) could've cooked up this idea to take the Osprey and use it as a Trojan horse to, IDK, maybe sidle up to the rest of the Royal Marines' ships and capture them one by one, til they could launch a sneak attack against the facilities in Clarion orbit, or even against Fortress Gollwin and Morgaine's World, wiping out Spacefleet and Star Law HQ, before shifting into Gran Quivera orbit and bomb the crap out of Port Loren and knock out PGC's HQ and the Council of Worlds(or hit both worlds at once)in a nasty little cross between Pearl Harbor and 9/11. Then, with the help of the Liberation Party, they could plant evidence that the Crown was to blame, distracting a vengeful Streel(playing both sides), PGC, Spacefleet and Star Law's energies fighting what would be a nasty little civil war(as some of the Frontier worlds and megacorps will line up with Clarion, while most stand with the Council of Worlds). And, all the Sathar will have to do is sit back, and pick up the pieces. What would Tabbe's motivations be? Why settle for the clichéd he was brainwashed and hypnotized line. Maybe he's a Liberationist, or is in bed with him, because he's megalomaniac with delusions of taking the Leotine crown for himself.... " 'Beware the Beast, Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport, for lust, for greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land. Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him; drive him back into his jungle lair, for he is the harbinger of death." |
January 23, 2011 - 12:07pm | Wow Will, I like some of your ideas about Tabbe. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
January 23, 2011 - 12:18pm | I'm not confident you could capture RM ships without drawing a lot of attention. Unless your thinking the crew will all become unwittingly sathar agents. Even then there is a chance someone is able to send out a warning. |
January 23, 2011 - 2:13pm | The "willing sathar agent" is always one I like to explore. After all, humans sell each other out regularly in modern society, so I can easily see it happening in a future/interstellar society. However, the way the module is written --- I have to side with Tabbe being captured/hypnotized. A willing agent would arm himself with something more deadly (not to mention sporting a much greater range) than an electrostunner... |
January 23, 2011 - 10:11pm | The "willing sathar agent" is always one I like to explore. After all, humans sell each other out regularly in modern society, so I can easily see it happening in a future/interstellar society. However, the way the module is written --- I have to side with Tabbe being captured/hypnotized. A willing agent would arm himself with something more deadly (not to mention sporting a much greater range) than an electrostunner... Now, that's another thing I couldn't understand...why zap Rhanda? The worms attacking our heroes in the cargo bay had no plans on taking them alive, and, from the way the module was written, she and the PCs were the Osprey's only crew. " 'Beware the Beast, Man, for he is the Devil's pawn. Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport, for lust, for greed. Yea, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land. Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him; drive him back into his jungle lair, for he is the harbinger of death." |
 January 24, 2011 - 7:54pm | I mentioned this before, an AS can jump at least twice. In the design rules it is noted that a ship with atomic drives do not need all of their engines (page 36 and 39 of the remastered KH rules). One can infer from this then that you can jump on just one engine since you will rarely accelerate at faster then 1 ADF. Between acceleration, deceleration, and replotting for the next jump, your engineer should have plenty of time to overhaul the engine not being used for the current jump. Jumping in this manner will allow the AS to keep the pace with her larger fleetmates. The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of
the strong. * Attributed to Mahatma Gandhi |
January 25, 2011 - 4:06am | Assuming normal jump conditions...once you get into the realm of smoking the jump, all bets are off and those not ready either get left behind or arrive slagged |
January 26, 2011 - 5:49am | Exactly. The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of
the strong. * Attributed to Mahatma Gandhi |
 January 28, 2011 - 12:58am | All intriguing points. My take has always been that the Sathar are just not that good with technology. Yes, they have very advanced technology, but their society, let's face it, is not conducive to thought - even if for the benefit of the Empire. I have always liked the angle that the Sathar are numerous and suicidally brave, but just not quite up to the snuff of the Frontier, who are constantly innovating in every possible endeavor. The Sathar system itself harms them in this area. As to the pirate question, I would imagine that there are simply not that many pirate Assault Scouts. The ones that are around are very tough even for the UPF to find, let alone the Sathar tooling around in Frontier asteroid belts looking for assault scouts and worried about getting jumped by UPF patrols. Sathar Agents that manage to approach pirates about their ships find that they are not for sale - at any price. Note also that pirates are not crazy about the Sathar - at all. The cat is out of the bag - the Sathar want to kill the pirates too. They are not going to be fooled by some wormy promises. Everyone in the Frontier knows what time it is with the Sathar. In fact, in the more remote areas of space, the Sathar and pirates probably get into some nasty tangles from time to time. In terms of military doctrine, the Sathar probably don't see the Assault Scout as fitting in to their arsenal, but perhaps they can learn something from its design or innards. |
January 29, 2011 - 1:06am | Sathar Agents that manage to approach pirates about their ships find that they are not for sale - at any price. Yep, pirates are loathe to give up their ships. That's how they make their livings after all...if anything a pirate would want to increase his number of ships. Now what I would expect a pirtate to do --- follow the path of destruction a sather fleet leaves behind. As supplies start making their way into ravaged UPF systems, the pirates would strike these convoys and make off with the goods. |
 January 29, 2011 - 11:50pm | And, take out the unprotected worm supply lines just for the joy of killing them. And taking what ever they can as booty. A pirate opts for the "live to fight another day" option when taking on that Sathar. He is going to guy hiding on their escape route after the UPF has trounced them. That way he has done his duty the safe way and privately. -iggy |
January 30, 2011 - 10:04pm | I believe there would be a lot of frontiersman that would hunt sathar out of revenge for the fallen. Never really thought of that... but so many lives have been and are effected every week that I bet a lot of people carry shotguns loaded with salt!!!! |
January 31, 2011 - 3:37am | Parriah had a neat spin in his online game based on sathar hatred coupled with the "ne'er do well" types. One of the antagonists in the game (that just won't go away) is a small time local hovercycle gang called the "Triad Sathar", named for the city in which they occupy and the Frontier's most hated obstacle...which is something that inspires both fear amongst the regulars as well as hatred and animosity from the same (a biker gang is not exactly something that thrives to meet the status quo). Their tradition is to wear garb or jewlery manufactured from actual sathar hides...be it a sathar skin vest or a shrunken head on a neck chain etc. |
 February 1, 2011 - 10:32am | IMO, the plot in the module happened because: 1. The Sathar wanted a look at this new "cutting edge" ship design, mostly to look for weaknesses. After all, most planetary militias seem to be getting them. 2. Lt. Tabbe was in position to hand them one. There may not have been a sleeper in position in a pirate fleet. |
February 1, 2011 - 12:27pm | In my own Campaign there are two ships in the Frontier spacefleet whose design are well guarded secrets, the Knight Hawk starfighter, and the Assault scout. these two ships have their components built by several corporations, who only build a specific part and have no knowledge of the other corporations identities or what parts they are building. These parts are shipped to Spacefleet headquarters who then has them taken to a secret construction site (Some rumor has it that the Royal shipwrights of White Light are the actual builders but that's just rumor....or is it?) that puts these components together to build these two ships. Because of this the Sathar are very interested in acquiring either of these ships. I also don't ever allow Pirates to have Assault Scouts as the crews for Assault scouts in my campaign undergo extensive physical and psychological testing to insure that unsavory (read Sathar agents) gain access to them after what almost happened to the Osprey in my game. "Hey guys I wonder what this does"-Famous last words "Hey guys, I think it's friendly." -Famous last words "You go on ahead, I'll catch up." -Famous last words "Did you here that?" -Famous last words |
