 December 2, 2007 - 4:13am | So let's hear what you'd like to see in this area. I mentioned a basic guideline of +5/10/15 depending on simplicity/complexity of situations, with the Military PSA being up in the air at the moment...I was going to introduce artillery grade weapons (heavy laser, rocket launcher, recoilless rifle) and give a -10 penalty when using, obviously a PSA:Mil can negate that one. Perhaps allow the +5/10/15 to apply for extreme/long/medium ranges as well, with the premise that anyone can fire a weapon at shorter ranges but it takes training to hit targets farther away. Technical skill resolutions for the most part should rely on the character's LOG score, Medical could rely on INT, and PsychoSocial could fall under PER checks with the modifiers. Non PSA characters can attempt resolutions at half that with no bonus. |
 December 2, 2007 - 4:21pm | I'd say just take a simplistic approach - this is Basic afterall - and just state that anyone who has "Military" PSA just gets a +10 to all actions arguably justifiable as a militant activity. Those with "Technological" PSA just get a +10 whenever they're being techy, etc. I assume you're not wanting to add skills to the Basic system - so this is a pretty simple way to handle stuff. 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
 December 2, 2007 - 10:53pm | Keeping it simple while having a little difference between folks -- can't say I've decided what option I like, as I see merits in both of your above suggestions..... +10 across the board is simplest, but seems to de-value non-Military PSA (IMO.) The +5/10/15 is actually a part of Basic play (tied to difficulty, not PSA, but on page 8....) The 'at range' thing seems like a reasonable differentiator.... Technical skill resolutions for the most part should rely on the
character's LOG score, Medical could rely on INT, and PsychoSocial
could fall under PER checks with the modifiers. Non PSA characters can
attempt resolutions at half that with no bonus. Hmm.... I'd add complex military stuff that should be at half skill for non-PSA (demolition, heavy weapon, ....) But then, getting too complex / hurting the military folks too much out of combat? 1/2 only applies to complex stuff across the board? Too many judgement calls for the GM? Ayways, this here ramble is more to let you know I'm thinking about it that really providing anything useful.... And maybe call this version 'streamlined' or "Basic++" ;-) ;-) |
December 3, 2007 - 3:03am | Yep, p.8 is where I got the +5/10/15 bit from. Although I also lean toward Bill's suggestion, which ironically is what I originally applied to the online game when Tichat-Ka was attemtping to unlock the door. And yes, no need/desire for skills in the game. From a starting point, a straight STR or DEX roll to hit is far more generous than most 2nd level skills allow (even with a decent STR or DEX score), but not up to par as what an experienced 5th or 6th level skill could do. |
December 3, 2007 - 12:17pm | Either one works I suppose, though I'd prefer to keep the +/- 5/10/15 modifiers for suggested in-game situation modifications. If I'm a Technical PSA in these Basic rule improvements (btw. I like Basic++ but that's cuz I'm a nerdy programmer sort, and think Basic.net sounds silly haha), I'll make sure I get my +10 bonus to anything remotely resembling technical activities. And when it comes time to fight, my straight dex score is already giving me a fairly good chance to hit. Gret's +10 to hit because of his militant background would only be fitting. I don't think anyone gets favored. In combat, military PSA folks are favored. Out of combat they typically won't be the ones trying technical things (and I suppose same goes for the biosocial folks too). Basic Skill Areas Another idea is to sorta bridge the gap between a skills system and a PSA system, allowing Basic++ characters the ability to get better over time (which is currently lacking in the Basic system). How about players can have levels in their PSA? Each level would give +5, and we could provide 3 basic levels (therefore, +5, +10, and +15). It's sorta like a skill but simpler, and it gives Basic characters something to do with experience points so they don't all end up with all 100 ability scores. Balance it any way you want, but here's a suggestion off the top of my head: Since the Military PSA has 7 skills, multiply the expert game's experience point cost by 7 for each skill level. Since the Technological PSA has 3 skills, multiply by 3, etc. This way, if characters are ever converted to Expert game characters (for example, once they hit level 3 in all skills and want more play), characters will convert easily (for example, if you had a Military PSA at level 2, you'd convert to having level 2 in all seven Military skills):
Well anyway - that's just an idea. I'm not sure if it's too complicated for a Basic game. 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
December 4, 2007 - 12:46am | Part of me likes character progression, but it also gets away from the simple, especially for NPC creation / management (IMO, although I haven't GM'd in years.) Although with the above PSA costs, increasing DEX will get you a lot more bang for the XP than trying to go military PSA..... Although this is more for a current GM to comment upon..... |
December 4, 2007 - 7:27am | That's a good point. My initial thoughts may be a bit off - the problem is that when I add up all the military skills and came to 7, it resulted in a really high cost because I operate under the assumption that you are actually buying skill levels in all seven of those skills. Maybe my idea isn't a good one. I was just brainstorming :P 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
December 4, 2007 - 1:02pm | Brainstorming is good, IMO, and I had thought about the same thing (although cheaper... ;-) In the end, up to SS to determine what he thinks is fun AND workable.... ;-) Easy for me to keep track of my one character (although i sometimes even don't do that well), but when you have to design & run multiple NPC's and keep track of PC's..... |
December 4, 2007 - 1:18pm | [recalibrate]I think part of my problem is that I'm envisioning Basic as being a precursor to Expanded. That's how it was in the published rules. You couldn't really play Basic for very long; it was just a quick way into the game, into the action, before you moved on to Expanded rules. But let's look at some other systems. D&D had a "Basic" version and an "Advanced" version - and Basic was and is a viable game on its own, with its own rules and everything. Marvel Super Heroes also had a "Basic" version which played fine on its own. In both of these cases, sufficient rules existed to play those basic versions indefinately without ever having to leap to the expanded/advanced versions if you so desired. In fact, (because I'm not a huge fan of abstracting wealth), I preferred the Basic version over the Advanced version of Marvel Super Heroes for years before I finally agreed to switch my players over (stupid players don't know what's best for 'em). So maybe I'm just not thinking about a bigger picture. I think it's Shadow Shack's position here (please correct me if I'm wrong) that this project is for the construction of an improved and stand-alone RPG that is a lite version of Star Frontiers, not just a stepping stone to get players to the Expanded edition. If that's the case, then yes, let's give thought to lethality, let's give thought to statting out vehicles, let's give thought to each aspect of the system in order to make a "lite" edition of Star Frontiers that might be fun and fully playable as an alternative to Expanded. Of course... certain elements of Star Frontier Expanded rules are already pretty 'lite' (I'm thinking about skills here mostly), but if we're re-engineering a Basic edition... I'm game to considering anything.[/recalibrate] 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
 December 5, 2007 - 2:36am | I prefer to keep it as simple as possible. Let their ability take care of anything absolutely necessary to determine random chance. Everything else is determined only by the fact that it is their chosen PSA. A Technological PSA knows everything about computers and robots and machines, but knows nothing about the other PSA's except what is common to people who do not belong to those professions. This produces the movie trait where the hero always knows everything about their field. This is simple, allows some amount of progression and keeps things exciting. After thinking about my view of what the Basic game entails, I think it should just provide the PSA's as skills themselves that you can level up on, using the basics of skill development. I think it should be as stated similarly to existing language as such: Primary Skill Areas At the start of the game, each player must choose one Primary Skill Area (PSA) as his character’s career. This will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that PSA and can advance up to Level 6. For each level in that PSA the character gets a +10 bonus per level to ability checks. Skill checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the PSA’s chance to succeed. There are three Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological and Biosocial. Each PSA has an associated ability set: Military skills deal with combat, military operations, and red tape. Its associated ability set is STR/STA. Technological skills deal with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. Its associated ability set is DEX/RS. Medical skills deal with medical and psychological pursuits affecting health and fitness. Its associated ability set is INT/LOG. Explorer skills deal with the intelligent races and their surroundings, including botany, zoology, and social interaction. Its associated ability set is PER/LDR. Advancing Levels As a character adventures and succeed in their missions, they will be awarded experience points that they may then use to improve levels in their PSA (You may not advance more than one level between adventures). Each level costs 6 experience to improve. This would be the whole of the skills section in the Basic game. No need to expand it any further. As you can see, this is simple and maintains the basics of skill operation, while maintaining a higher degree of success for cinematic action. |
December 5, 2007 - 2:32am | First off, I'd like to offer a mission statement. While Basic Revisited (Basic++, or whatever we end up calling it) is my project, I really don't look at it as MY project. There have been a lot of good ideas presented, I'll drop one, Corjay will drop another, Jaguar will drop one, Bill will drop one...I feel we should just run with the idea that we agree to as being the best of each category. To expand on Bill's analogy of other basic systesm, yes that's the primay goal here: to create a system that can be played indefinitely if so desired. The most fun I ever had with D&D was with the basic modules. But still, playing a LVL:1-3 character for eternity can lose its appeal, a LVL:3 fighter doesn't own castles, command infantry troops, or fight Dragons very successfully. Hence the expanded rulesets (or D&D Expert, Advanced, etc). So in the end, the Basic Revisited project goal is to create a fun play system that goes beyond the simple "Introduction to Star Frontiers" stepping stone format it was orignally presented in. Not something that will be played indefinitely, but still something that will be played for more than one or two sessions. __________________________________________________________________________________ Now...with that out of the way, lots of good ideas above (or below, depending on how you have your forum settings LOL). I'm hesitant to introduce experience points in Basic...although I sort of already did in the online game session by awarding "ability points". Still, I do feel there should be more to offer as a reward than mere money. |
December 5, 2007 - 2:50am | Well, if you change the bonus in my system to +5 per level and remove the 6 level ceiling, then that allows the levels to increase for a long time. You would have to reduce the cost of the skill to account for the bonus decrease; maybe 4 experience points. You have to make it that low because each point added to an ability increases the ability check by +1, so skills would have to be cheaper to provide a greater benefit, otherwise skills would be moot. |
December 5, 2007 - 2:41pm | I wanted to mention that - while it's fantastic to get so many ideas flowing - any project sputters to a halt unless one person is the lead of the project - in this case Shadow Shack. He is the one with the vision for this project. So even though I foreword a suggestion, I understand you have to select an option which may or may not be in line with my thoughts. It's important when collaborating that all members have mature egos and accept whatever a project's leader decides on. If you're loathe to have any kind of experience points - then we should cement that as a guideline for this rulesset. Ability points... Skill points... all of those are primarily just experience points. So I think before we further discuss options for skills in a Basic game, we should decide if there is to be any form of progression/reward other than through equipment. Shack - your online Basically Speaking game isn't necessarily requiring that you allow for ability points in this rulesset. 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
December 5, 2007 - 5:05pm | While I'm not exactly loathe to a XP system in Basic, I just feel that once you open the door it mandates something more to spend them on. The LVL:1/2/3 PSA example could work, but I'd prefer to do away with the term "level" and simply call it a +5/10/15 breakdown instead.To me once you add the word "level" then it implies that the level should be infinitely adjustable, as there's always a "next" level. Zeb's even went on that premise, LVL:6 wasn't enough so they changed it to an 8 level breakdown. I could whip up another rewrite and claim a LVL:10 breakdown, and someone else can mandate a 12 level breakdown...I figured "ability points" as the ability checks are what determines success in the Basic game, so if a character is to be improved it's those abilities that should be infinitely adjustable. And I firmly believe that character improvement is essential if a game system is to be incorporated over a period of time. That was the downfall to Traveller...you had generated characters with a boatload of skills but they rarely improved, all you did was travel the universe and acquire wealth, fame, and political pull etc while the actual character pretty much stayed the same. It's the one reason why everytime we got going in Traveller, we always reverted back to Star Frontiers... The PSA question was simply a reaction to the Online Character Generator more than anything, so this discussion serves to explore exactly how that can be incorporated into the Basic game without creating a slew of technical rules and tables etc. That said, a graduated PSA bonus makes the resolution process more realistic, I'm just wondering if there's a way to do it aside from XP rewards. Perhaps an "annual" ability check, such as LOG for techs? (just throwing out an alternative) |
December 5, 2007 - 6:39pm | I think it should be as stated similarly to existing language as such: Primary Skill Areas At the start of the game, each player must choose one Primary Skill Area (PSA) as his character’s career. This will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that PSA and can advance up to Level 6. For each level in that PSA the character gets a +10 bonus per level to ability checks. Skill checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the PSA’s chance to succeed. There are three Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological and Biosocial. Each PSA has an associated ability set: Military skills deal with combat, military operations, and red tape. Its associated ability set is STR/STA. Technological skills deal with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. Its associated ability set is DEX/RS. Medical skills deal with medical and psychological pursuits affecting health and fitness. Its associated ability set is INT/LOG. Explorer skills deal with the intelligent races and their surroundings, including botany, zoology, and social interaction. Its associated ability set is PER/LDR. Advancing Levels As a character adventures and succeed in their missions, they will be awarded experience points that they may then use to improve levels in their PSA (You may not advance more than one level between adventures). Each level costs 6 experience to improve. This would be the whole of the skills section in the Basic game. No need to expand it any further. As you can see, this is simple and maintains the basics of skill operation, while maintaining a higher degree of success for cinematic action. "There are three Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological and Biosocial." Um, you list four in the details.... And that last one isn't in the online character generator, FWIW. Zebs, right? (not saying we can't take from Zebs, but....) |
December 5, 2007 - 9:27pm | Okay let's build on this: Military skills deal with combat, military operations, and red tape. The associated abilities would be STR & DEX (as this is what is used to determine hits in combat) Technological skills deal with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. The associated abilities would be INT & LOG (as the technician will mostly be wracking their brains to figure something out in each field) BioSocial PSA deals with environmental, medical, and psychological/social pursuits. The associated abilities would be INT & PER (as the inherent ability to recognize things and dealing with others being the most widely used traits) Say that each starts off with a +5 bonus. So for military, that gives them an edge in combat for the medium/long/extreme ranges (and perhaps a melee bonus as well). In the tech field the bonus applies to any electronical or mechanical manipulation. BioSocial gets it for interacting/persuasion attempts along with deciphering surroundings and perhaps as an added healing bonus. This way it fleshes out the basic character...a tech can still fire a gun with respectable chances to hit, but doesn't have the training for the long range shots. A militant can use the standard first aid pack but only gets the 10 points worth of healing whereas the BioSocialist can benefit from the kit and his own bonus to add to that. The BioSocial character can operate a vehicle, but doesn't do as well when wrestling info from an enemy computer. So all that's left on this example is to decide a simple and fair way to improve that to +10 and +15. I mentioned the time factor, have it increase over player time (not actual time). As for ability increases...well the two traits listed above obviously aren't going to be the sole go-to traits. A tech driver will still require to pass RS checks when avoiding obstacles in a skimmer at high speeds (19mph LOL), a militant can still try to convince a shop owner to trade him weapons in a dire emergency via PER checks, a biosocialist may still need to remove a heavy object from a pinned victim, etc so I still stand by my guns as the eight abilities being the prime thing for character improvement. One final thought...if the PSA allows for a bonus, how do you feel about a non-PSA penalty? Such as a tech making a long range weapon shot recieves an additional -5/10 penalty, or a militant trying to bypass a security system, etc? |
December 5, 2007 - 9:22pm | [Corjay, your Basic PSA breakdown says:] "There are three Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological and Biosocial." Um, you list four in the details.... And that last one isn't in the online character generator, FWIW. Zebs, right? (not saying we can't take from Zebs, but....) It's Zeb's, but I think ZG simply corrected a serious wrong in the original rules. In my opinion, Environmentalist in no way should ever have been forced into a blanket "biosocial" mold with the healing sciences. They're unrelated in every way. Again, that's just my opinion, and I don't see a problem in separating them, but others might, so it's something to consider closely. For AER I separate them. It's the only change in AER that it can be said that I force it on the player. From what I've seen, I think it's a consensus in the community. It's just that some stick to Biosocial out of habit or sticking to the original rule as created even though disagreeing with the original rule. |
December 5, 2007 - 9:37pm | Corjay -- so, update that intro sentence from three to four, and get the PSA names right... ;-) ;-) FWIW, I like the concept of the Explorer, especially in Expanded. (in D&D, I like Ranger....) In SF Basic, I could go either way..... D&D Basic did have four classes, and we do need a thief/scout type.... ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) |
December 5, 2007 - 10:57pm | So all that's left on this example is to decide a simple and fair way to improve that to +10 and +15. I mentioned the time factor, have it increase over player time (not actual time). .... One final thought...if the PSA allows for a bonus, how do you feel about a non-PSA penalty? Such as a tech making a long range weapon shot recieves an additional -5/10 penalty, or a militant trying to bypass a security system, etc? A few thoughts: * I like XP.... Could maybe do a simple thing such as it takes 2 XP to raise an ability point, 5XP to gain each '+5' (no graduated cost for +10 or so....) So, raise skills faster by gaining PSA 'levels' than by raising ability points, but a bit slow progression? * Minus' -- is it a replacement for lower PSA plus' due to using ability scores vs 1/2 ability scores? I do like the idea, just wondering at the complexity added.... If do go with it, I was thinking along the lines of specific PSA are bad at certain things.... Such as: * Military: -5 Technical (Break things, but do need to learn how to patch up wounds now and then) * Techical: -5 BioSocial (Geek Squad!) * BioSocial: -5 Military (Supposed to heal people....) * If had Explorer: -5 Tech (all that time out in the woods) * Do we want to leave any 'advanced' skills PSA only (GMs discretion?) Demolition is military only, for example. * I like your breakdown of primary abilities per PSA, although might even include three (STA also important for Military, LOG for Medical, DEX for Tech, although maybe going a bit too far...) |
December 5, 2007 - 11:21pm | Well, for some reason it says I don't have the authority to edit my original post (though i can edit my other posts at will. What's the deal?) Anyway, try this: Primary Skill Areas At the start of the game, each player must choose one Primary Skill Area (PSA) as his character’s career. This will never change. To use a PSA, use the full ability score (as opposed to half ability for unskilled ability checks). PSA ability checks work just like regular ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the PSA’s chance to succeed. By advancing the ability, you advance the PSA. There are four Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological, Medical, and Explorer. Each PSA has an associated ability set: Military PSA deals with combat, military operations, and red tape. Its associated ability set is STR/STA. Technological PSA deals with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. Its associated ability set is DEX/RS. Medical PSA deals with medical and psychological pursuits affecting health and fitness. Its associated ability set is INT/LOG. Explorer PSA deals with the intelligent races and their surroundings, including botany, zoology, and social interaction. Its associated ability set is PER/LDR. This way a non-PSA ability check is at half ability per normal and a PSA check is full ability. No skill progression and allows the PSA to improve. A non-PSA ability check could only advance 1/2 a point for each ability point added to the ability score, while a PSA ability check can advance a full point for each ability point added to the ability score. |
December 5, 2007 - 11:34pm | IMO, 1/2 ability for non-PSA is too much of a penalty. Well, for some reason it says I don't have the authority to edit my
original post (though i can edit my other posts at will. What's the
deal?) Can't edit a post someone else quoted... |
December 6, 2007 - 12:17am | If you're not skilled, why is that such a bad penalty? The idea is that you're a lot less likely to succeed in that skill. Otherwise you have to include a bunch of clear distinctions (turning the Basic game into a quagmire of rulings) or use skill levels, which require experience, which SS seems opposed to for the Basic game. I think what SS's mind was working on was adding +5 after every adventure automatically, which is fine by me, but seems to reward simple survival of the mission (which is fine. Reward for survival is the classic D&D way). It seems to me just to call it level 1, 2, etc. You can avoid the use of experience, because it improves automatically in exactly the same way as just using the +5 bonus. There's no difference, so why make unnecessary distinctions? |
December 6, 2007 - 6:19am | Well, for some reason it says I don't have the authority to edit my original post (though i can edit my other posts at will. What's the deal?) It's a Drupal thing. If someone quotes you or clicks on the "Reply" link directly under your wording, you're no longer allowed to edit it because if you edit something that someone quotes then it invalidates the quote. 3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
December 6, 2007 - 6:25am | Okay let's build on this: This is simple and effective. A non-PSA penalty may not be necessary really. The Referee (or um.. reader or whatever?) should be an arbiter on what part of an action requires training and what natural talent can get away with. For example, a biosocial character might walk up to a computer system and punch up some common data, but if he wanted to hide his tracks the Refereader might simply say "no, that requires training you don't possess" - and that should be that.Military skills deal with combat, military operations, and red tape. The associated abilities would be STR & DEX (as this is what is used to determine hits in combat) Technological skills deal with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. The associated abilities would be INT & LOG (as the technician will mostly be wracking their brains to figure something out in each field) BioSocial PSA deals with environmental, medical, and psychological/social pursuits. The associated abilities would be INT & PER (as the inherent ability to recognize things and dealing with others being the most widely used traits) Say that each starts off with a +5 bonus. So for military, that gives them an edge in combat for the medium/long/extreme ranges (and perhaps a melee bonus as well). In the tech field the bonus applies to any electronical or mechanical manipulation. BioSocial gets it for interacting/persuasion attempts along with deciphering surroundings and perhaps as an added healing bonus. This way it fleshes out the basic character...a tech can still fire a gun with respectable chances to hit, but doesn't have the training for the long range shots. A militant can use the standard first aid pack but only gets the 10 points worth of healing whereas the BioSocialist can benefit from the kit and his own bonus to add to that. The BioSocial character can operate a vehicle, but doesn't do as well when wrestling info from an enemy computer. So all that's left on this example is to decide a simple and fair way to improve that to +10 and +15. I mentioned the time factor, have it increase over player time (not actual time). As for ability increases...well the two traits listed above obviously aren't going to be the sole go-to traits. A tech driver will still require to pass RS checks when avoiding obstacles in a skimmer at high speeds (19mph LOL), a militant can still try to convince a shop owner to trade him weapons in a dire emergency via PER checks, a biosocialist may still need to remove a heavy object from a pinned victim, etc so I still stand by my guns as the eight abilities being the prime thing for character improvement. One final thought...if the PSA allows for a bonus, how do you feel about a non-PSA penalty? Such as a tech making a long range weapon shot recieves an additional -5/10 penalty, or a militant trying to bypass a security system, etc? "Refereader" (c) 2007 Bill Logan  3. We wear sungoggles during the day. Not because the sun affects our
vision, but when you're cool like us the sun shines all the time. |
December 6, 2007 - 5:47pm | LOL @ "Refereader"...that could become the official title here. How about spelling it "Refereeader" instead? Okay so ixnay the penaltiesay. That was just a random thought and I agree with what's been said about it. |
December 8, 2007 - 1:12am | Here's another offering, adding the Secondary Skill Areas from the Spaceship thread: Primary Skill Areas
At the start of the game, each player must choose one Primary Skill Area (PSA) as his character’s career. This will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that PSA. For each level in that PSA the character gets a +5 bonus per level to ability checks. The character gains 1 level in that PSA after each adventure. To use a PSA, use the applicable ability score plus the PSA level bonus. Skill checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the PSA’s chance to succeed. There are four Primary Skill Areas (PSAs): Military, Technological, Medical, and Explorer. Each PSA has an associated ability set: Military PSA deals with combat, military operations, and red tape. Its associated ability set is STR/STA. Technological PSA deals with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. Its associated ability set is DEX/RS. Medical PSA deals with medical and psychological pursuits affecting health and fitness. Its associated ability set is INT/LOG. Explorer PSA deals with the intelligent races and their surroundings, including botany, zoology, and social interaction. Its associated ability set is PER/LDR. Secondary Skill Areas A Secondary Skill Area (SSA) is just like a PSA, except it relies on a pre-existing PSA and has an ability score prerequisite. You must reach an ability score of 60 in one of your PSA's abilities before taking on an SSA SPACER SSA is for a character who lives and works on starships. They are an elite group that is not bound by the restrictions of a single planet or even a single star. Only Technological and Explorer PSA's can become Spacers. GUNNER SSA controls large weapons of all kinds. Only a character with the Military PSA can become a Gunner. I noticed that you included something quite similar at http://www.starfrontiers.us/node/351 * How about calling them Professions? Seems more basic than 'PSA'..... * The descriptions could be a little more fleshed out by including high-level information from the advanced game Started some info below, but ran out of time, so something for consideration, but needs work.... Professions At the start of the game, each player must choose one Profession for his character’s career, which determines the skills at which the character excels. This profession will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that profession. For each level in that profession the character gets a +5 bonus per level to ability checks for activities related to that profession. The character gains 1 level in that Profession after each adventure. When performing an activity related to their profession, use the applicable ability score for that activity, plus the profession level bonus. These checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the Professions chance to succeed. There are four Professions: Military, Technological, Medical, and Explorer. Each Professions has an associated ability set: Military professionals are police officers, porporate security personnel, private investigators, and mercenary soldiers.. Their skills relate to combat, demolition, military operations, law enforcement, ... The associated abilities are STR & DEX (as this is what is used to determine hits in combat) Explorer professionals operate as guides, scouts, or scientists for scientific or military expeditions. Explorer skills deal with the exploration of worlds, including wilderness survival, Botony, Zoology, archeology, foreign languages, Exobiology, .... The associated abilities are DEX, LOG, & PER (for moving in the wild, ability to analyze things, and dealing with others being the most widely used traits) Medical Specialist (SciSpec) professionals are doctors, psychologists, medics, or EMTs. Their skills deal with medical and psychological pursuits. The associated abilities would be INT & PER (as the inherent ability to recognize things and dealing with others being the most widely used traits) Technological Expert (TechEx) professionals are mechanics, pilots, drivers, computer experts, .... Their skills relate to building, fixing, hacking, and driving machines, planes, computers, or robots. The associated abilities would be INT, LOG, and RS (as the technician will mostly be wracking their brains to figure something out in each field, but also needs to drive at high speed) |
December 8, 2007 - 2:59am | Here's what I've put in AER, with some adjustments for application and limiting skill checks. Primary Skill Area At the start of the game, each player must choose one Primary Skill Area (PSA) as his character’s career. This will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that PSA. For each level in that PSA the character gets a +5 bonus per level to ability checks. The character gains 1 level in that PSA after each adventure. To use a PSA, use the applicable ability score plus the PSA level bonus. Skill checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the PSA’s chance to succeed. You may only perform a skill check once in the Basic game. There are four Primary Skill Areas (PSAs), each with an associated ability set (These do not preclude the use of other abilities in their profession. It just means these are the usual goto abilities associated with it.): Explorer PSA deals with the intelligent races and their surroundings, including botany, zoology, find directions, and social interaction. An Explorer may map, navigate, and plot routes in any region of a planet or stars with a successful skill check. They use PER/LDR for dealing with others and with animals and surviving in hostile environments Military Enforcer PSA deals with demolitions, combat, military operations, and law enforcement. A Military Enforcer may operate any weapon with a successful skill check. They use STR/STA to determine hits in combat and hand-to-hand combat and overcome combat damage and physical exertion. Science Specialist (SciSpec) PSA deals with physical and psychological sciences affecting genetics, health and fitness. A science specialist may cure diseases and treat mental illnesses with a successful skill check. They use INT/LOG for problem solving, coming up with cures and straightening out peoples' problems. Technological Expert (TechEx) PSA deals with various types of technology, including machines, computers, and robots. A Technological Expert may drive or fly and fix any vehicle or spaceship with a successful skill check. They use DEX/RS for handling the delicate hand work and responding quickly and surely to crisis situations. I decided to let the the Military Enforcer take care of gunnery, and the Technological skill take care of all Spacer skills. |
December 8, 2007 - 3:14am | By the way, I don't want to name them "professions" outright, because 1) I want the "skills" part to be paramount, and 2) some object to the "professions" nomenclature. |
December 8, 2007 - 3:56am | At the start of the game, each player must choose one Profession for his character’s career, which determines the skills at which the character excels. This profession will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that profession. For each level in that profession the character gets a +5 bonus per level to ability checks for activities related to that profession. The character gains 1 level in that Profession after each adventure. When performing an activity related to their profession, use the applicable ability score for that activity, plus the profession level bonus. These checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the Professions chance to succeed. Cool so far, but I'm at odds about gaining one level per adventure...strictly going by ability checks the character already has a rather fair shot at performing things. Say you get a new "tech" character with a LOG:70, after 4 adventures he'll be performing his duties at near-automatic success (with a base chance of 95%...meaning no success with the auto-fail-no-matter-what roll). If there were some restructuring on the advancement part, I could be ga-ga over something like that. Maybe start off at LVL:0 and complete one adventure for LVL:1, complete two more adventures after that for LVL:2, complete three more after that for LVL:3, etc. Also, would/should there be a maximum level limitation? I think a LVL:3 max should suffice, that's (ABILITY +15) for base success, and +15 is the max bonus in the canon book. I decided to let the the Military Enforcer take care of gunnery, and the Technological skill take care of all Spacer skills. Works for me. Once this Basic Revised gets rolling we can tackle the ship specific stuff later, but for now that's a good lead-in. |
December 8, 2007 - 9:50am | At the start of the game, each player must choose one Profession for his character’s career, which determines the skills at which the character excels. This profession will never change. The character starts with Level 1 in that profession. For each level in that profession the character gets a +5 bonus per level to ability checks for activities related to that profession. The character gains 1 level in that Profession after each adventure. When performing an activity related to their profession, use the applicable ability score for that activity, plus the profession level bonus. These checks work just like ability checks: roll d100 and try to roll less than or equal to the Professions chance to succeed. Cool so far, but I'm at odds about gaining one level per adventure...strictly going by ability checks the character already has a rather fair shot at performing things. Say you get a new "tech" character with a LOG:70, after 4 adventures he'll be performing his duties at near-automatic success (with a base chance of 95%...meaning no success with the auto-fail-no-matter-what roll). If there were some restructuring on the advancement part, I could be ga-ga over something like that. Maybe start off at LVL:0 and complete one adventure for LVL:1, complete two more adventures after that for LVL:2, complete three more after that for LVL:3, etc. Also, would/should there be a maximum level limitation? I think a LVL:3 max should suffice, that's (ABILITY +15) for base success, and +15 is the max bonus in the canon book. I decided to let the the Military Enforcer take care of gunnery, and the Technological skill take care of all Spacer skills. Works for me. Once this Basic Revised gets rolling we can tackle the ship specific stuff later, but for now that's a good lead-in. |
