 June 10, 2013 - 6:44am | Reason for doing a conversion: at its core SWON is a D20 system and since D20 based RPGs remain the 900 pound gorilla in the RPG market it makes sence to open up Star Frontiers to a segment of the hobby that only knows D20. Plus SWON is a rather elegant presentation of D20 rules IMO. Secondly you can create any human SF character with SWON as is so why not adapt it to the SF setting and open up possibilities for dralsites, vrusk and yazirians in this system? There is also the interesting correlation of only 6 levels of skill in SWON which could aid in converting characters. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 10, 2013 - 6:56am | So my first thought on adding the core four is that its essentially the same as choosing a background in SWON. But i've simplified it to just a set of racial ability score adjustments and racial abilities. The improvable abilities will work exactly like a skill in SWON and will be improvabale in the same manner as in class skills. Thats the simplest method of adding them and has the benefit of matching the rest of the rules mechanics. Next some of the class background from SWON are not very compatible with the SF setting so background and training packages for each of the classes should be tuned up as part of the conversion. Then, uniquely SF equipment should be statted out for SWON. all of the above would go into installemnt 1 of a conversion guide series. Just today it also occured to me that background or training packages could be developed for each of the SF cadres as well as racial backgrounds for the SF aliens- ie yaz specific backgrounds that might include skill with yazirian honor weapons or such like. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 June 10, 2013 - 7:26am | Just today it also occured to me that background or training packages could be developed for each of the SF cadres as well as racial backgrounds for the SF aliens- ie yaz specific backgrounds that might include skill with yazirian honor weapons or such like. This is good stuff. Packages for each faction is a great idea. Another really cool feature of SWON is the faction rules. Pretty abstract, to be sure, but I find the way the system spurs my creativity as I am trying to determine what is happening in the frontier as the PCs are off doing something. Then I put out a 'news feed' once per session with what events have transpired: Streel did so and so. Pirates raided X, etc. I am intrigued by the d20 system SWON uses, but don't know if I could go all out and run it personally. I think the percentage based mechanics of SF lean toward more pulpy heroic fiction, where the super lethal OD&D style d20 is not. And the SF rules are a little more "class-less" which is pretty freeing as well. All my tangent aside - great idea for a project. Definitely interested in this. |
June 10, 2013 - 7:43am | Dont get me wrong, I dont think that SWON rules are for everyone; however they would have been ideal for the D&D 3.5 sticks in the mud I used to play with who resisted trying anything else. And i like the retro throw back to B/X D&D of SWON. I think once i have a chance to dig more fully into SWON and perhaps run some games I will tackle a SF conversion of their factions stuff. My rough outline of the conversion articles is 1. Character gen 2. Robots and computers. 3. ? KHs maybe. 4. Factions and mega corps I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 10, 2013 - 7:46am | Ooops forgot i plan to detail a bestiary of SF creatures for SWON, possibly just sathar creatures and stuff for SWON first then latter a Voltunus beastiary. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 11, 2013 - 8:36pm | Considering equipment: star frontiers has defense tech that can really soak up damage as long as the power holds and there are weapons that can be employed to dish out heavy damage (lasers dialed up to high SEU) SWON lacks the screen tech for the most part and lasers are more or less on par with with automatic weapons. So you can go two ways with this: 1) just use SWON equipment as is and not fuss about the missing SF tech or 2). Adapt the SF equipment list to SWON. Is it still SF if you cant fire your laser for 10-100 points of damage or chop an opponent's arm of with a sonic sword? I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 12, 2013 - 6:30am | Considering equipment: star frontiers has defense tech that can really soak up damage as long as the power holds and there are weapons that can be employed to dish out heavy damage (lasers dialed up to high SEU) SWON lacks the screen tech for the most part and lasers are more or less on par with with automatic weapons. So you can go two ways with this: 1) just use SWON equipment as is and not fuss about the missing SF tech or 2). Adapt the SF equipment list to SWON. Is it still SF if you cant fire your laser for 10-100 points of damage or chop an opponent's arm of with a sonic sword?
Agreed. The sonic sword especially is iconic in SF. I personally am taking the path of keeping the SF tech and introducing other tech to the SF setting. One thing I'm doing is that I have introduced another region of space that did not share the same tech tree as the Core 4/Frontier setting. They employ weapons that generate two types of damage: Ion weapons which cause both electrical and laser damage, and what I'm calling pulse lasers which cause Impact and Laser damage. The thought is to have the tech trees combine and over the long run, phase out the older tech with something else, which would in turn look more like SWON. |
June 12, 2013 - 12:16pm | Looking over the design notes, comparing weapons and damage output vs STA/hit points the realization hit that there is a radical difference in the two games. One opperates on hit dice and hit points and the other uses a percentile ability for hit points. One system can tollerate higher damage expressions from the get go and in the other characters are fairly fragile from the get go. I think that any SF equipment ported over must be statted to fit in with existing SwoN weaponry. Nothing Tech level 5 from the SwoN list exists in the Frontier except psitech but its in limited numbers. TL 5 stuff could exist by referee fiat as prototypes developed in corporate research labs. Lasers have burst fire feature so i think they can be said to have a 1-3 shot setting where a player may specify that he's setting it for "3 SEU". I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 June 12, 2013 - 4:59pm | While not the 900 kilogram gorilla in the room, anyone interested in a d20 conversion of Star Frontiers is welcome to look at the Star Frontiers URS project which at its core is a rewritten version of the D20 system that offers a classless Hero creation system, requires no miniatures, has completely revamped feats, and reworked equipment lists and has a knighthawks rules supplement. While it's not stars without numbers I've been play testing it with my gaming group and so far the system holds up and has proven to be a lot of fun. "Hey guys I wonder what this does"-Famous last words "Hey guys, I think it's friendly." -Famous last words "You go on ahead, I'll catch up." -Famous last words "Did you here that?" -Famous last words |
 June 12, 2013 - 9:35pm | Looking over the design notes, comparing weapons and damage output vs STA/hit points the realization hit that there is a radical difference in the two games. One opperates on hit dice and hit points and the other uses a percentile ability for hit points. One system can tollerate higher damage expressions from the get go and in the other characters are fairly fragile from the get go. I think that any SF equipment ported over must be statted to fit in with existing SwoN weaponry. Nothing Tech level 5 from the SwoN list exists in the Frontier except psitech but its in limited numbers. TL 5 stuff could exist by referee fiat as prototypes developed in corporate research labs. Lasers have burst fire feature so i think they can be said to have a 1-3 shot setting where a player may specify that he's setting it for "3 SEU".
You could either double damage in SF, or half the STA score for a body point mechanic like BareBones Fantasy. That sort of thing is up to both the designer and the GM running the game. The long combat in SF has caused some to do just this. But then D&D has been known for its long combat as well. I'm not familiar with SWON. View my profile for a list of articles I have written, am writing, will write. "It's yo' mama!" —Wicket W. Warrick, Star Wars Ep. VI: Return of the Jedi "That guy's wise." —Logray, Star Wars Ep.VI: Return of the Jedi Do You Wanna Date My Avatar? - Felicia Day (The Guild) |
June 14, 2013 - 9:51am | @ Deryn Res: I'll take another look at tge project, we'll continue with the project to convert another system to SF as a way of expanding relevance and readership of the FE magazine.
@ascent: I'm beginning to think that this conversion guide is going to be purely for groups starting fresh with SwoN and not groups converting in mid campaign. This its not really going to matter that some elements of the two systems are apples and baked potatos.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
June 20, 2013 - 5:07am | Not to reapeat the past mistakes of others, in this instance Gygax with the myriad table of pole arms in AD&D all with individual statitics and all doing slightly differernt damage, when at the end of the day they are all just long sticks with a pointy thing at the end, but... I'm considering that very mistake. SwoN has all the polyhedrals in its system and various damage expressions like 2d4, 1d8 and etc. This would be optional of course but I wast hinking to expand the range of weapons- instead of having just one auto pistol and auto rifle that variations on the theme might be created- derringer pistols, and other models of pistol for some variation- allow a player to choose the weapon with the trade offs he's looking for. Perhaps a Yazirian weapon that is available on yazirian worlds at one price but X2 or x3 the further you get from the yazirian colonies. Out of production models that are rare but highly sought after, etc- these might fill the role of treasure. (according to one blog I read recently the achilles heal of Sci Fi RPGs is the lack of treasure that players want to cart off some treasure- dont know if that is true) You kill the pirate you can claim his rare weapon, that is if you survive him using it on you. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
