 December 31, 2011 - 11:16am | Or perhaps I should state that as age of adulthood since some peeps never mature. In humans its run the gammut of late teens to twenty. Industrialized heavy population world probably tend toward the older end of that range while out post and light population world could tend toward lower numbers. I was just wondering what the age ranges should be for the core four? My first knee jerk reaction is vrusk must mature fairly fast. For yazirians it could be less then for humanity and Drals could be anything from a little less then humans to a little more. Comments? I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 December 31, 2011 - 1:04pm | I see Vrusk as being quite consistent that you are expected to be a mature contributor to society after your first molt. At least this is what I wanted to say right off the top of my head but then I don't think we have ever explored the maturation process of the Vrusk properly. We know that at birth a vrusk is a larvae. But, how long does it stay a larvae and how big do they get before first molt? Then how many moltings do they go through before they reach full size? For Dralasites I have them mature after they have done their schooling with the stoa. The bud grows on it's parent then detaches. After detaching there is a natural desire to wander about exploring this new freedom. After about a year they settle in with their stoa for schooling. I have never put exact years on the schooling but have always thought of it being until they are 12 - 15 years old. I see Yazirians as maturing much like humans in their clans with adult supervision. I figure that they are considered mature somewhere around 16. -iggy |
December 31, 2011 - 1:16pm | I can buy what you're laying down, Iggy. I'm betting that vrusk molt several times to get to full size. I just needed a rough idea to figure into my Hilo Headow thread. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 6, 2012 - 9:22pm | In the legend of the first clan we used the name gliders to name the age of young hunters who had not yet gained the right to speak in the clan. I would say that babies and toddlers are called hangers for their propensity to hang on to you and anything that they are stuck to. They have a natural instinct to hang on and avoid falling. The age of maturity was call speakers. -iggy |
September 7, 2012 - 2:59am | In the legend of the first clan we used the name gliders to name the age of young hunters who had not yet gained the right to speak in the clan. I would say that babies and toddlers are called hangers for their propensity to hang on to you and anything that they are stuck to. They have a natural instinct to hang on and avoid falling. The age of maturity was call speakers. Hang? or would cling be a better word? Then they would be Clingons  Actually I like this Hangers, Speaker and Gliders, then Warriors, and finally eldars- each stage is actually gender neutral too which is good as well. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 7, 2012 - 5:10am | a very rough rule of thumb with a human would be the childhood portion of their life is 1/4 of the life span in the real world, in SF its 1/10 (again this is rough numbers). With shorter lifespans age of maturity comes sooner. The short time span covers 3 distinct period: infant-toddler, youth, and teenager (we could subdivide the infant toddler phase but I prefer not to as it is a phase that regardless of the actual age the child is heavily dependent on its guardians) now with a yazirian's lifespan being 140 (significantly shorter than a human) 1/4 would be 35 (too high IMO) and 1/10 would be 14 (too low or perhaps too low due to my human bias) I'm feeling age 16 as the age a yazirian becomes a Warrior. about 7 years of that would be the teen phase or glider phase. that leaves about 8-9 years for hangers and speakers and I'm feeling about 4 years for hangers (infant/toddlers) and 5 for speakers (youth). Age 16 seems believable enough and at times in human history 16 year olds were considered adults by their societies. making it younger than the typical human age of maturity makes it different from humans which is important to a degree. It might be that in the modern Frontier a Yazirian is not really fully finished with his education at age 16 and that in a technological society the age of maturity is being pushed back a little toward 18 (or at least i can imagine that). However, its very traditional that age 16 is the age at which a young yaz goes out on a hunt and makes his first kill. To be sure many yaz never make a first hunting kill any more due in part because they live in a very technologically oriented society and because their society is still trying to terraform their colony and indiscriminent killing of animals would not be good. Though some clans might just raise animals specifically to blood their young warriors in an rite of passage ceremony the whole clan celebrates. Clans or yazirians living on a mixed race colony like prengular might not do this at all. Clans that have moved into hi-tech and science fields might not bother with this. There would be social dynamic that when the sathar strike the Frontier you get young warriors trying to sign up for Land Fleet or Space Fleet because they are age 16 or 17 but they really haven't finished their schooling and eldar yazirians in the clan might council for them to finish school and then enlist. Many enlist because they are 16 and consider themselve warriors already (whether they have made a first kill or not) and desire to test their metal. Its an old story in human societies as well and perhaps a good begining point for a yazirian character background. BTW good ideas iggy I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 7, 2012 - 11:52am | Alright, four boobs to me means a litter of pups so possibly a few females have pups about the same time or at least fairly close to each other and this new generation grows together and since the clan is clan oriented not family oriented when its time to have a rite of passage for the pups its a clan ceremony and its for all of the pups. So what are the important rights of passage? Without a doubt becoming a warrior and one would expect a special bond to the other warriors that you grew up with and shared the same rite of passage with throughout your life. I think becoming a warrior is the most important thing and any other rite of passage is about instruction for the youth. I'm thinking that the clan does value the birth of a new generation and celebrates this during a scheduled clan celebration. I'm not sure that they would celebrate every new stage of maturity but perhaps would take note of the passage to being a glider- elders or older warrior takes them out and instructs them in fine art of gliding and at next clan celebration all the new gliders have a special part in teh clan celebration where they come gliding in and do something or present themselves to the elders and chiefs. A blessing or benediction is pronounced and the celebration moves forward. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 September 7, 2012 - 7:32pm | Guys, I like where you are taking the yazirians. A clan based society raising the pups as one. I agree with 16 as a good age of accountability. As you said Jedion, the more technological the society the older the age becomes. I would think that those clans who do not participate in traditional hunting would definately keep a ceremony for that. I would make it 18 similar to what we consider adult accountability now. The ceremony could be a skill test of some sort, maybe a traditional game that shows of their prowess but does not kill. Actually you could have the Fo1 do something like that. Kind of like Scottish clan games but they have a seven day event with certain tests to show they are now adults. As for vrusk, It would really depend on how long it takes for a molt. You could have 3 molts for each stage to show their growth. In each stage they become more accountable until after 9 molts they are an adult, then the molting slows down for the rest of their growth. Insects here grow fast, so if we use that as a template, we could have them molt each year until age 9 or 12, then they become accountable to the corporation and start to work. I think the vrusk would not want to be ineffecient in getting this new young workforce out there. So infant/toddler 1-3, youth 4-6, teen 7-9, or make it 1-4, 5-8, 9-12. Dralasites I agree would become "mature" after there stoa training is done. It seems the most logical, but do all the stoa have the same length of time? If they are a little different this would be a variable for the whole of drals, but at least it would have a defining line of gradutaing from the stoa. |
September 8, 2012 - 3:46am | I think that as a society the dralasite stoa would have very similar practices over all, sure stoa can be radically different in belief but the basic practices are very similar. My own personal non canon timeline would dictate a short history for the dralasite and thus require that social institutions have not diverge much from each other. But on the other hand if the dralasite has a 6000 year recorded history I still dont think you are going to get crazy divergence. I think that the dralasite propensity for testing their philosophy and beliefs and joining one stoa or another is just that and the fact that a dralasite can and does move around within the society from stoa to stoa that he will like or look for some familiar forms such that a stoa is a stoa is a stoa and what is important is the quality of beliefs and the quality of thought. I like the idea of vrusk maturing fast and with Yaz, human and vrusk ages of maturity identified I like the dralasite for a flexible age range between that of the Yaz and humans. Despite what I just said about about the dral not having a lot of divergence between stoa in practice, the idea of dralasite society being flexible in recognizing maturity seems right. In fact I rather doubt that dralasite society does something so arbitrary as, "Well, son, today you're 20 twenty years old, so you can vote, smoke, drink and die for your country." Instead i think that the age of adulthood could begin when the dralasite has made the stand in the circle of debate. Or if a dralasite should happen to live outside of dralasite society and not have the opportunity to make the stand in the circle of debate then when he reaches the upper limit of that flexible age range he is viewed as an adult by default but even then his goal should be to eventually make his way to a place where he can make the stand. So one dral might become an adult very young and another might take longer, the dralasite view is that it will happen when it happens and they dont really fuss over such things as numbers of years but rather quality of ideas. I'm content to just say 16-19 for the dralasite and leave it as an age range. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 8, 2012 - 10:32am | I really like the dralasite "stand" to attain adulthood. I agree that they would have a flexible view of maturity. The stand would entail standing in the center of the debate circle and old neuter drals standing at the edge and asking the great debate questions. The questions asses critical and mature thinking of the young dral pertinent to societies norms, needs, and responsibilities. After the young dral has debated the elder drals he is dismissed while the elder neuters debate the candidates readiness for adulthood. During this process the young drals stoa has an advocate for him among the elder neuters. We should list the subjects of the great debates in another thread. As for the ages of Yazirians I had blooded coming after gliders. Becoming a speaker is your right to lead in clan meetings. I see becoming blooded as a teenage right among yaz so that they can participate in clan councils. Here is my order from the Legend of the First Clan plus the new added hangers. Hangers - infants and toddlers ? - preteens Gliders -teens Blooded - adults Speakers - Clan leaders. Anciently one per hunting pack. A council of speakers makes a clan. -iggy |
September 8, 2012 - 10:43am | Ahh, I misinterpreted your use of speakers. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 8, 2012 - 5:04pm | The way you are describing the dralasite maturity reminds me of the old Kung Fu TV show. The Buddist training/philosophy of attaining enlightenment. A dral could become an adult once they obtain a certain philisophical enlightenment. But a pirate dral or the Malthar would be looked upon by dral society as one who never matured, maybe. |
September 8, 2012 - 7:32pm | I see what you are talking about Karxan. There could be a great debate about those drals that do not or will not pass the stand. -iggy |
September 9, 2012 - 5:56am | I think that there would be a stigma but not terribly crippling for a dral that does not make a stand particularly if circumstances worked against them in someway that prevented this rite of passage. It might be hard for a dral to advance socially in dralasite society but then one dral might overcome the social stigma through hard work and quality ideas and rise high in the philosophical eschelons of dralasite society much like spock in the last STar Trek movie when the Vulcan Science Academy said it was admirable that he had risen so high in spite of his handicap. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 9, 2012 - 6:47am | I would see drals who never had the chance for a formal stand getting one from their friends (even non-drals) when circumstances don't provide the opportunity for a formal stand to be arranged. The social problem is around those who refuse to take their stand. A lesser social problem are those who just never bring up that they didn't have their stand. This shyness or embarrassment is really only a problem when drals begin talking about their experiences of when they took their stand. They have nothing to share. They are likely accepted at all times but this one subject would be touchy for that dral and others would be eager to get him his opportunity to take his stand. This expectation that all drals take their stand is where the social friction can come. This is much like a high school diploma, just magnified. You are expected to have passed this to be part of society. Those who refuse it are fighting against dral society. I don't see the stand as a formally documented event. Just something you are expected to go through. One could just make up the experience but there is enough to it that those who have taken their stand can eventually detect when another is faking it. -iggy |
September 9, 2012 - 8:18am | Plus if you are part of a small connected community everyone knows. With modern travel opportunities and even interstellar travel it would be possible to move to a new city or planet and just not admit to having done this but this sort of thing usually carches up with you eventually. Interstellar travel is no proof against the truth catching up with you as there is interstellar communication independent of travel. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 9, 2012 - 1:05pm | As for vrusk, It would really depend on how long it takes for a molt. You could have 3 molts for each stage to show their growth. In each stage they become more accountable until after 9 molts they are an adult, then the molting slows down for the rest of their growth. Insects here grow fast, so if we use that as a template, we could have them molt each year until age 9 or 12, then they become accountable to the corporation and start to work. I think the vrusk would not want to be ineffecient in getting this new young workforce out there. So infant/toddler 1-3, youth 4-6, teen 7-9, or make it 1-4, 5-8, 9-12. I see Vrusk as some alien equivalent to insects and crustacea but not actually either. In Earth they would be part of the insect and crustacea parent family of arthropods but they are their own subphylum. I am saying this because I am searching for full understanding what drives their biological need to molt. I do agree that is slows down after they reach full size. Likely this does coincide with adulthood as you present. As for age ranges I like your latter 1-4, 5-8, 9-12 break out and your thesis that they are efficient at getting a new workforce out. What I would add to your age breakout is a 0-1 larvae stage before the first molt. In ancient times the first molt marked your start as a worker. Only as advancements were made did the need to educate beyond the years of the first molt develop. This duration grew until the current age 12 system. I also feel that the vrusk educate the larvae so they are able to operate in society right after their first molt. A vrusk after first molt is able to speak and knows all the concepts for reading, they have to get used to seeing the world with compound eyes and thus recognize the glyphs. They also know their math, etc. They are essentially good grade school students. After their first molt they must learn dexterity and practice all that they have learned in concept. Human and yazirian concepts of a childhood are mostly foreign concepts to a vrusk. The last piece I would add is the larvae stage should be at least 2 years. -iggy |
September 9, 2012 - 3:06pm | Been thinking a bit more on yazirian age groups and put ages. 0-4 Hanger (infant and toddler) 4-9 ??? (preteen) 10-15 Glider (teen) 16 Blooded (adult) 21 Typical mating age I'd like to work out this kind of breakdown for the other races. -iggy |
September 9, 2012 - 10:19pm | iggy, The larvae idea is great. In ancient times, as with humans, age maturation was at a lot younger age. So you are proposing something like: 0-2 Larvae 3-5 Infant/toddler 6-8 pre-teen 9-11 Teen 12 on Adulthood A vrusk would be able to walk, talk, read, write,and work ethic after their 2nd year. The more education, as time went on, created the other splits, Infant/Toddler stage would be where they learn math and history and sense of duty to the company. The pree-teen and teen stages could be about learning their place in the corporation, the path they will follow. Adulthood would be the time when they were eligable or able to mate. Then they are a full member of the vrusk society. I think the stages would have different names though. The vrusk would have a different way to explain each of the levels. |
September 9, 2012 - 10:43pm | Definitely different names, with eight legs you are not exactly a toddler. I just don't have any reference to start applying names. Actually the vrusk may find the yazirian and human need to name the growth phases an unnecessary extra ambiguation. They may prefer to just label each other by function. That leads me to the idea that the distinctions might be: 0-2 Larvae 3-5 Student 6-8 Apprentice 9-11 ?? 12+ Professional Let's play around with this thinking a bit and dig into the hive structure to adjust the functions the vrusk serves during each age period. -iggy |
September 10, 2012 - 4:42am | Definitely different names, with eight legs you are not exactly a toddler. I just don't have any reference to start applying names. Actually the vrusk may find the yazirian and human need to name the growth phases an unnecessary extra ambiguation. They may prefer to just label each other by function. That leads me to the idea that the distinctions might be: 0-2 Larvae 3-5 Student 6-8 Apprentice 9-11 ?? 12+ Professional Let's play around with this thinking a bit and dig into the hive structure to adjust the functions the vrusk serves during each age period. I would say use journeyman for age 9-11 or move apprentice up to age 9-11 and student up to 6-8 and look for a new name to go between larvae and student. or put "consumer" between larvae and student. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 10, 2012 - 8:32pm | I like journeyman for the 9-11. |
September 10, 2012 - 8:38pm | My brother came up with this break down: 0-2 Larvae 3-5 Soft Shell 6-8 Student 9-11 Apprentice 12+ Professional -iggy |
