 August 30, 2011 - 7:45am | As far as I know, I'm the resident seminary student, and its probably unsurprising that I'm interested in religion and have produce the lion's share of the "religious" content on this site and in the Star Frontiersman. Thought I'd create a resource thread for GMs on religion in RPGs; though the following links have a decidedly fantasy focus the ideas discussed are not so divorced from science fiction gaming as to be devoid of merit. The following while focused on fantasy games examines the questions of: The nature of the gods, the role of the church in character's lives, and how people join a church in the setting http://nevermetpress.com/religion-in-roleplaying-games The following discusses the pros of using a monotheistic religion in your rpg: http://www.stargazersworld.com/2008/11/17/monotheistic-religions-in-roleplaying/ The following is a monotheistic approach to D&D where the D&D dieties are angelic servants of the one true god. its actually a throw back to Greek myth where the sky and earth bring forth the gods, the sky representing the over god http://kingworkscreative.blogspot.com/2009/04/dnd-monotheistic-approach-to-dnd.html The following is a arguement/blog on why RPGs are safe and not a threat to religious sensibilities; some of the author's logic is flawed but they mean well. The general message of the sermon is lets be tolerant which is unsurprising when you consider the web address. http://www.religioustolerance.org/lusby01.htm Because and search of "religion" and "RPGs" will turn up stuff on the rpg panic, 700 club, BADD, and such The following link is an archive in both German and English documenting every scientific study done on rpgs- its a surprisingly long list and there are no smoking guns proving that we're all satanist http://www.rpgstudies.net/ Feel free to post any articles or blogs you turn up about using religion in RPGs, I'm currious to read them if no one else is. Also this thread could be a good place to discuss ideas and themes in using religion in Star Frontiers specifically or rpgs in general. There has been wide spread sentiment in America that you dont discuss politics and religion in public and my experiences with chatting with peops on line from other countries suggests its not unheard of around the world at least in countries that have had a strong Judeo-Christian tradition. I get it if you are not interested in discussing religion, and this thread is not for discussing the merits of particular real world religions- that thread belongs in "Open Discussion" What should be discussed here is religion within a RPG setting. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
August 30, 2011 - 8:06am | I'm just throwing out ideas here: Level of detail about a setting religion- How much is enough and how much is too much? Is too much detail possible? Is pan-theism the only believable Sci fi religion? (pan-theism is a belief that god exists in everything and is most famously represented by the Force in Star wars). I've repeatedly found myself using pan theism as a model when I've created a religion for a sci-fi setting. its has a low a discomfort value for religious and non religious players a like. Where as if I played an osakar Jehovah's Witness and actaully role played aggressive evangelistic activities with the other players the discomfort value would be extremely high. Other prominent religious models are monotheism, polytheism, agnosticism, animism, and atheism I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 September 1, 2011 - 7:01pm | You could also through in acient alien theory. Aliens from the past are mistaken as gods and could infuence a world. Religion in SF is a great way to start a conflict between two groups. If anyone gets offended just remind them it only a game. |
September 1, 2011 - 7:42pm | You could also through in acient alien theory. Aliens from the past are mistaken as gods and could infuence a world. Religion in SF is a great way to start a conflict between two groups. If anyone gets offended just remind them it only a game. As much as I dont like that idea after dealing with a rash of irrashional people in the real world who absolutely assure you that something very much like that really did happen on earth based on the thinnest of thinnest evidence and you have to just believe them because they sayso and if you dont your either an idiot or one of those religious right wing nuts or something when in fact you're simply asking for extraordinary evidence to back extraordinary claims. Oops off topic rant. However, your idea has a lot of merit especially if it was the tetrarchs. but then you'd need some similaries and themes in the religions of the races involved. There'd be some conspiracy theorist going on about these similarities and some of the religious would point to them as evidence of a one true god. most people will largely go "huh" and then go on with life. at some point the PCs get involved by stumbling onto something that sends them on a path of discovery. sounds like an archeaology and artifact heavy adventure. The thing to absolutely avoid is a cliche Star Trek ending with some advanced energy being shows up and explains everything and puts a stop to all the pointless squabbling and war. Deus ex machina! I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 2, 2011 - 5:12pm | True, and like I said it just a game. The conspiracy theme is a great idea. |
 September 10, 2011 - 1:50am | Level of detail about a setting religion- How much is enough and how much is too much? Enough is enough, too much is too much ... Enough is what is usable for at minimum a setting background environment vista ... too much is an entire book on every set of few thousand religions, on every inhabited world in a 30ly sphere ... too little is when you have people assuming that one religion is practiced EXACTLY the same Way on every continent, moon, asteroid, extra solar colony, and 100 year old divergent lost population of just one given species... Is too much detail possible? Yes, If your hand cramps, your eyes get blurry, you run out of passion for the subject, and someone says "hey, you need a bath..." you might be reaching a limit of detail... at that point check yourself, breath, come back in a week and see if it's still only a few pages long... or can at least be condensed into a few hours read ... most rpgs don't need any single focus setting detail to run over 98 pages ... a week of afternoons, or a weekend read at that size ... for star frontiers ~32.66666666666667 pages of relevant information, might be more scientifically concise, in detailing a given religion on one planet or well connected system, or for any cluturally interrelated grouping of ethnic philosophies in a singular geographic region of just one planet. Is pan-theism the only believable Sci fi religion? No, as far as I am concerned every religion and philosophy not only has merit in a Sci-Fi setting but should be included, AT LEAST in background detail... and be as diverse as 30 planets worth of religions would accumulate... and be full of everything from "culturally-indoctrinated non-believers" to all out "zealots of the anti philosophy"... everything in-between and all around... Establish Diversity, and then Diversify it... Progenitorites and Ancient Alien Theorists are an expected must in any sci-fi, and should not only exist in the frontier, but be equally at conflict with as many divergent groups as any other religion or philosophy... After all was it the Ant People or the Squid People that were in charge at our indoctrination into uplift, are they still here as "void space" beings or on an even higher dimensional plane that will one day make our ships travel even further and faster... or alleviate the need for ships altogether and allow us to physicly gate to new worlds... Are the people in charge now the true "rightful heirs to the throne" or are the people in charge the rebellious usurpers that committed patricide and now torment the descendants of the old-ones as the citizenry, while the common people unknowingly to even themselves could make life easier for everyone if they were freed from the tyranny and mind-altering drugs in the food, and could one day reclaim awareness of their genetic heritage? Has the struggle gone on for so long that no side is even "pure" anymore, and no "justice" ever possible, and no ancients even exist to return and reconcile? And don't forget, even the ancient genetic tinkering and gold mining Iknewnohocky and their elite ruling Neverlunians had not one but many religions and philosophies of their own, in their equally dynamic and ancient alien culture... so xenoarchaeology will still find many divergent aliens over many worlds and easily over look that it was all the same race, or at least the same empire... because the colonies were culturally independent, not even toiletry architecture is necessarily the same on many divergent planets... possibly even across several systems... (just look at all the different toiletry architectures in Europe alone, then multiply those differences and add alien aesthetics... archaeologists still disagree on the pyramids being of the same architectural basis through out the world in spite of their being constructed near simultaniously and in no other global-era, and the struggle for "easier explanations" than large stones being transported over oceans even when the minerals match no where else locally but perfectly on other continents... who ever it was in those ancient times, it still wasn't primitive people... and that is still significant in and of itself...) Then there are the Cats that never left, and the Dolphins that are just on vacation, the Rats that test the scientists, and the Abominable Snow-Himalaliens... many of these barely have religions devoted to them anymore... which is fine, most of them didn't care to be worshiped anyway... and just go about their business pretending to be dumb animals as a cover... oh wait... about religion... Yes, I'll take a doz. ... that should cover one colony world for me. Allow the diversity to exist. There is nothing wrong with it. Hell, we put up with the religious right-we can put up with transgendered human beings. ~ Jessica Lange Oh humans!!  We discover a galactic community filled with multiple species of aliens, and the first thing we think about is "how can we have sex with them?".~ anymoose, somewhere on the net... so... if you square a square it becomes a cube... if you square a cube does it become an octoid? |
 September 10, 2011 - 12:32pm | When in doubt go to television. Babylon 5 had a very good treatment of religion with each of the major and some of the minor ones being covered. Remembering that religion is part of a culture some of the races the religion was the culture others mostly ignored it. Alien Nation had the only alien race I know of who had more than one religion like humans. Thinking that is the fault of mostly lazy writers though. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
September 11, 2011 - 6:01pm | This was easy enough to find, so probably only worth mentioning as it was a suprise to me... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_ideas_in_science_fiction All of these "don't do's" are indeed staples... but I concur with the idea presented... and I say use tropes, don't let them use you... http://io9.com/5185748/the-7-deadly-sins-of-religion-in-science-fiction ...Also an interestingly silly discussion in the forums there... Several Martyrs and Saints of Science come to mind as being elevated to the status on the same technical grounds that are prerequisite... (That is if you don't mind comparing apples and oranges from the perspective of a pear in the eleventh dimension... then, it observationally becomes a similarity constant that people do not like having their world-view challenged... it makes them feel insecure... "Does god play dice? If so, does god roll in front of the screen, or behind it? ... Either way the big sh/e/it obviously likes platypus jokes, and silly-string fights." ...) Another checklist of sci-fi literatures that purportedly deal heavily with religion... http://sfgospel.typepad.com/sf_gospel/2007/12/the-10-best-sf.html And for a really good read about what is and isn't "just good fiction" or "heretically irreligious", and possibly even why the subject is full of contradictions of acceptability... http://www.sfsignal.com/archives/2008/03/mind-meld-is-science-fiction-antithetical-to-religion/ I have rhetoric questions... did I read too much into the Heinlein's religions, were they just there in my expectation and not really written into his stories... or maybe, am I wrong about him being a grandfather of Sci-Fi? Some of the You-Tube world-building tutorials have some nice chapters on religion... but again... I find nothing of significance on Sci-Fi religions... or Sci-Fi RPGs for that matter... Both of these points seems counter intuitive, with the number of Sci-Fi based games out there vs. Fantasy... and the large amount of Sci-Fi Game Gamers I have known... why isn't there more? As nearly every really good sci-fi example I can think of has had at least SOME element of religion or religious context, and is nearly always about some philosophical question even when it isn't, why do so many people seem to think sci-fi is in opposition to religion and philosophy? If I didn't make it obvious... I will say it again... I am FOR religion and philosophy being showcased as the cornerstone of a culture... bring it on!! Even your baby-eating Orc God is welcome at my table... I'll even take your Government Propagandized and Demonized Messiah Cult in a shadow war with the Angelic backed Powers That Be while the Ancient Alien Sumerian Progenitors referee and place side-bets on the skirmishes and Cthulhu takes over a television network in India and hires televangelists to report on "The Big Game" like sports-commentators... oh wait... it's Star Frontiers... not Gurps Illuminati... Religion and Politics don't offend me... and I am not afraid of the A-bomb... Seriously tho' I think it is a bit of a let down that the only two examples given for the Frontier officially, are tongue-in-cheek sarcasms of religious pantomime... and I would like to see the Family of One (and it's mentioned but unnamed tribal counterparts in the other clans), and the Skoa of the Humble Servant be given a more serious representation, and not be relegated to just "another wild dralasite prank of unfathomable humor" or "one world, one species, one mind, and a corporate theocracy on the side" ... Oh humans!! We discover a galactic community filled with multiple species of aliens, and the first thing we think about is "how can we have sex with them?".~ anymoose, somewhere on the net... so... if you square a square it becomes a cube... if you square a cube does it become an octoid? |
September 13, 2011 - 7:34am | So are we starting or do we have a Religion in the Frontier project going? One thing to remember by time Star Frontiers had come out TSR had already come under fire from "religious people" for a variety of reasons so they probably just wanted to avoid it all. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
September 13, 2011 - 9:46am | So are we starting or do we have a Religion in the Frontier project going? One thing to remember by time Star Frontiers had come out TSR had already come under fire from "religious people" for a variety of reasons so they probably just wanted to avoid it all. I never started a religion project as most religions could fall under background material and I rather doubted that there would be collaboration on a "religion" since it usually is a touchy subject. For instance a humma or ifshnit religion could easily be handled in the Zebs Guide Expanded project and a core 4 religion could go in the core four project as well. Typically I've just made stuff up and submitted it to the SFman. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
September 14, 2011 - 6:07pm | Now I will have to look at all the Star Frontiersman to find the religion articles. Thanks another thing for my to do list. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
September 14, 2011 - 8:16pm | Now I will have to look at all the Star Frontiersman to find the religion articles. Thanks another thing for my to do list. Issue 15 "opiate of the osakar" Only one of the religions listed is an osakar religion and the rest are core 4 but then all are osakar religions. One of my favorite titles for an article. plus the wyvoles creation and the awesome artwork by Crow, Wow he totally caught my mentatl image of that creature. there's other little bits of religion tucked in places here and there and I cant think of where off the top of my head but I'm sure they exist, however this was the first full up religion article. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
