UPF Frigate Development Forum

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 18, 2009 - 6:45pm
This forum thread is to allow for imput and feedback from the community as I'm working on the UPF frigate deck plans
This initial post is all the info I pulled together on a frigate culled from the rules and a tenative crew break down.

The plan is a Dundjini style full color deck plan and computer flow chart like the one in the thruster class deck plans plus maybe a few notes for using the ship in a campaign

Knight Hawks (Advanced Game) describes the frigate as such:
HP:40 ADF:4 MR:3 DCR:70 Weapons: LC, RB x4, LB, Torp x2
Defenses: RH, MS x2, ICM x4
Crew: 25-30; 2 Hatches; 3 engines (typeB)

The standard length of a HS 5 ship is 100m but this can vary: 75-125m
The standard diameter of a HS 5 ship is 15m but this can vary: 11-19m

5 escape Pods 1 lifeboat, (1 Decoy possible), (5 atmosperic probes possible),
1 4man launch

My suggestions for Crew Compliment:

Astrogation: 2-?- (1 Lt & ensign)
Weapons: 4-? (1 Lt & 1 ensign and 2 enlisted ratings)
Helm: 3 (for 3 shifts?) (1 Lt & 1 ensign 1 Lt junior grade)
Command: 3 (Captain, commander & Bosun)
Medical: 2 (surgeon & SBA:sick berth attendant)
Engineering: 7 (Lt or commander, 2 POs, 1 ensign, 3 enlisted ratings
Services (laundry & galley etc.): 3 + robots- (1 PO 2 ratings)
Marines: 6 (1 Lt junior grade, 1 Sgt and 4 privates)
Total: 30 min

I think I'll axe communications and scan and give those responsibilities to astrogation to keep the total crew to 30 : 9 officers, 4 ensigns, 17 enlisted

the ensigns are officers in the larva stage (overworked and under appreciated) tailor made slots for Player characters with room to be promoted to Lt jg during a campaign and not unheard of to be put in charge of a landing party or in charge of a prize crew to take back a captured pirate ship.

In theory the Bosun is the highest ranking enlisted and handles all problems with enlisted and wipes the noses of the ensigns and keeps them from making total fools of themselves- Bosuns and POs are the keepers of the tribal wisdom within the service as they are carreer personal

Commander as 2nd in command maintains the ship and training making sure the ship is ready for battle so that the captain is free to consider the mission and tactics

Surgeon is an officer but not in line of command his SBA is enlisted and a good possibility for a player character.

Chief engineer should be a senior Lt or commander He has 3 shifts with one supervisor (the POs or the ensign) and 1 rating each

Services: Unglamorous but necessary- PO in charge with 2 ratings and handful of robots responsible for necessities of life - enlisted that are screw ups but not bad enough to be kicked out of the service often end up here and its not been unknown that services personal sometimes get involved with back market goods for the comfort of the fellow crew they also double as orderlies for medical during battle

Marines not much to this, they support damage control during battle and repel boarders as well as are the point team boarding hostile vessels- they hate pirates as they're the ones who often get 1st hand view of pirate activity when boarding freighters shot up by pirates. another good source of player characters
Also not unheard of for an ensign to be put in charge of a party of enlisted marines with the long suffering sgt trying to keep the ensign from causing to much trouble.

Anything I miss or any suggestions?
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!
Comments:

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 18, 2009 - 9:55pm
I have a projected deck plan, feel free to comment or recommend

1. Bridge and Laser cannon service access hatch

2.Officer quarters and main computer

3. Stores

4. Services, life boat, Masking screen

5. Sick bay, life support, Recreation computer library, Laser battery

6. Rec Deck, Rocket Battery, Marine country,
6.5 ICMs

7. Crew quarters, escape pods

8. Stores, arsenal (small arms), launch, hatch

9. Engineering workshops, engineering computer, work pods (3?), back up life support

10. Main Engineering, engine access hatches

I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Rum Rogue's picture
Rum Rogue
January 19, 2009 - 9:32am
Sounds like a solid frame to me.
Time flies when your having rum.

Im a government employee, I dont goof-off. I constructively abuse my time.

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 20, 2009 - 7:10pm
I'm trying to link a page from my photobucket account to show the break down of decks super imposed on a UPF frigate miniature:

http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/ff83/jedion357/?action=view&current=Frig_unpainted.jpg

That said I think some rearranging of the decks posted above is due
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 20, 2009 - 7:40pm
New list of decks:

1. Bridge and Laser cannon service access

2. Officer Quarters and main computer

3. Main hatch, life pods, arms locker, captains launch

3.5 Captain's launch

4. Stores and masking screen, main life support

5. Crew Quarters, life boat

6. Marine country and gun deck (all battery weapons & ICM & Torps)

7. Sick bay (in emergencies the galley becomes an overflow ward)

8. Services: Galley, recreaction, laundry, life pods, secondary hatch (in line with the laser battery to help dissaude unauthorized access!)

9. Back up Lifesupport, workpods, workshops (machine shop & robotics)

10. Main engineering

Also warships require a lot of redundancy (for when they get shot up) so I'm planning 2 major computer systems: one to opperate the ship from the bridge and  the back up computer to opperate the ship from engineering (though I may just tuck in an auxillary control which would normally operate as a training station and that could be part of the recreation facilities.) I was also thinking that sick bay should have a stand alon computer dedicated to all things medical. I also didn't see a problem with a 4th computer for the games and entertainment library.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
January 20, 2009 - 8:59pm
Sounds good.  I love the overlay on the minature.  I agree with the redundancy.  There is no reason not to have multiple computer systems and other redundant systems on board, espcially since once you get to a frigate hull size, there is plenty of volume to work with. 
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 20, 2009 - 10:30pm
just an update here:
http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/ff83/jedion357/?action=view&current=d123.jpg

next to each elevator shaft is a ladder well (shiny metal hatch) and a blank area that is the engineering chase (conduit for power lines, air ducts, water and waste pipes)

Deck 2 is now the main hatch, main life support, ensigns quarters, arms locker

Deck 3 will now be officer quarters
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Anonymous's picture
w00t (not verified)
January 21, 2009 - 7:42am
Them's some big engines!

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 21, 2009 - 12:02pm
w00t wrote:
Them's some big engines!


You mean in the picture of the miniature? I got a batch of ship minis and learned what lead rot was as the battleship was covered with it- but none of its engines were attached and they somehow escaped contracting lead rot. So I had a bunch of engines and a bunch of frigates and I always thought the frigate mini looked stupid without any real engines (just that chemical reaction style rocket out the back). If I may be so immodest I think my painted frigate is the best looking ship on the war gaming table.

heres a little pick of the corroded battle ship:
http://s237.photobucket.com/albums/ff83/jedion357/?action=view&current=leadrot004.jpg
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
January 21, 2009 - 7:28pm

http://upffrigate.20m.com

That's some scans of a UPF frigate I whipped out back in the day. Not accurate as back then I thought "RBx4" meant four single shot rocket batteries...but it's what I've been working with for a revision these days.


Also check out http://upfdestroyer.20m.com for the larger counterpart. Further fuel would be http://melindamccoy.20m.com that sticks closer to the lead mini. (BTW since you're already committed to a frigate deck plan I'll simply do (BTW since you're already committed to a frigate deck plan I'll simply do the destroyer for this project).

My revisions would include a brig and small cargo bay on each (my old destroyer has a small 1U hold, but ultimately I'd like one on the frigate as well).


As for crew positions, I usually entrust communications and detection to one crew member. It can be the astrogator or computer operator in a pinch (for smaller crew sizes). As for shifts, the standard UPF day is 20 hours so you really only need two shifts of 10 hours each.

The only hole I see is the small compliment of marines...six is about what you might expect from a militia assault scout. A UPF flagship...I'd expect at least a dozen. Possibly allow the various gunners to be marine commanders to trim the total crew down while boosting marine detail up.

P.S. I have no issue on two drives...I figure the KH chart is pretty wrong in that respect anyways seeing as HS:5 & 6 craft call for 3 B drives and larger 7 & 8 hulls only need two B drives. Certainly a military ship would get away with streamlined stats even going by the canon chart.

I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 21, 2009 - 9:08pm
@ shadow Great critique I didn't even think of a brig! and one of my favorite novels, Honor Among Enemies, has a brig that plays a nice part toward the end. I was a little bothered by the size of the marine compliment and I'll certainly institute your suggestion as it makes sense and works. I also think that the crew should have more enlist personel though I suppose under KW rules for ship skills that at least 75% of those with the education to operate ship equipement ought to be officers. Then again not all militaries have the same philosophy on ratios and roles of officers and enlisted yet my read on the UPF is that it should be close to something like the US.

I'm forcing myself to jump through 2 hoops, probably needlessly, 1 is following the "letter of the law" concerning KH data on frigates (even crew size) and 2 I'm trying to match decks to the shape of the TSR miniature. I figure that since I'm producing something for public consumption I should limit "going off road" as I do so often with recipes and cooking. If it matches most expectations then it should be well recieved.

Still keep the criticism coming, its well appreciated.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
January 22, 2009 - 9:29am
If you need more space you can always add more decks.  A HS 5 frigate is 100m long.  At ten decks, even if all the open space and machinery for a given deck takes up 5m of vertical space (and you typically only need 2.5-3m for head room) that is only 50 of the 100m available.  Obviously some of the space will be take up by ship machinery (although a lot of that can be included in the extra 2m of vertical space on each deck) so not all is available, but if you need an extra deck or two it shouldn't be that hard to fit them in.
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 22, 2009 - 10:57am
Yep with a bigger marine compliment I'll need a deck just for them and leave the current gun deck for weaponry and an office for a, "master of arms,"  I guess would be the name for guy in charge of discipline and policing, and some brigs, maybe even put in an office for the bosun here.

I'm also thinking that there should be a magazine with reloads for the rocket battery and the torps- have to include some load lifters like Ripley used in aliens on that deck.
I ordered this mini to fill that role:
http://www.oldgloryminiatures.com/proddetail.asp?prod=SF-VH-03
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 22, 2009 - 8:13pm
Ok I have the outlines of 10 out of 14 decks worked up in the mapping software and a new deck plan:
1. Bridge
2. Main Hatch, arms locker, computer room, Ensign berthing
3. Officer quarters
4. Captains launch, life support
5. Stores
6. Crew quarters
7. Marine country, brig
8. Magazine (rocket and torp reload) Water supply (masking screen)
9. Gun Deck
10 Sick Bay & Aux Control (doubles as a Flag Bridge when a flag officer is aboard)
11. Rec Deck & secondary hatch
12 Galley, officer and enlisted messes, laundry
13. Workshops and work pods
14. Main engineering

Crew by Department:
Astro and scan: Lt., ensign, 1 CPO & 1 rating
Helm: Lt. & ensign
Command: Captain, Commander, Bosun
Medical: Dr. & SBAs (sick berth attendants)
Engineering: Lt., 1 CPO & 4 ratings
Services: 1 PO & 2 ratings supported with 6-12 robots
Marines: 1 Lt., 1 Gunny Sgt., 1Corp (master of arms) 7 privates (assist with Damage control and gun crews during battle)
Wepons: 1 Lt., 1 ensign, 1 CPO & 1 rating

Totals: 8 officers, 3 ensigns, 24 enlisted =35

I Specified Chief Petty Officers in certain places to keep ensigns from out of trouble or in the case of services it didn't seem that an officer was warrented to watch the galley and mess halls. I kind of envision the PO stuck in services as a carreer screw up put there as the last stop before being put on shore; he's had trouble in the past (fighting & contraband) and been bust down from chief petty officer as many times as he's made the rank. The Bosun keeps an eye on him and lets him think he's getting away with a certain amount of contraband but the minute he steps to far out of line she plans to kick his arse up arond his ears.

I left communications and scan  under the Astrogator's authority (it really seemed those things fell into his realm) and made sure he had the staff to handle it all. There are now 10 marines which would have been a full 3rd of the crew but I increased the total to 35. There is also an Auxillary control which doubles as a training simulator and as a Flag Brigde when a flag officer is aboard.
There should be a few empty bunks left so if a Flagg officer comes aboard there will be room for his staff.


I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
January 22, 2009 - 9:04pm
Another crew issue I found --- I don't see the need for 7 engineers. Well, aside from giving the ship a kick azz DCR that is. Technically two would suffice, replacing the other five with technicians and maintenance robots. After all, more often than not the engineer is coordinating the repair and work orders from a station, not actually getting his hands dirty per se (but a good leader jumps in anyways).

Here's what I might lay out for an estimated 30 man crew roster:

Officers
Captain and XO (high ranking/higher ship skills, either may fill in for pilot/astrogator/engineering)
2 pilots
2 astrogators
2 engineers
3-4 gunners (one for each system, the fourth being an optional cannon assist working with the pilot)
Administration Officer (aka Bosun)
10-13 officers
 
Enlisted positions
6-12 marines (lead by gunnery officers), some of which may also fill in for some of the following:
Chief medical officer plus possible assistant (with one or the other also specializing in Psyche)
5-6 technicians (one or two may operate the communications and detection systems if desired)
2 Computer Operators
Chief Roboticist
Steward
Cook
Chief Security Officer
Optional Environmental Officer (replaces one tech)
14-20 enlisted

Considering two 10 hour shifts, that works out well...and during emergencies all crew can be mustered for any job at hand (combat, post combat repairs, boarding, etc).
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
January 22, 2009 - 11:22pm
On a ship this size I still stick with at least 4 engineers as the standard, personally.  That would give you two on duty at all times to monitor ship systems and fix anything that comes up.  Probably two of them would be level 2 engineers straight out of the acadamy on their first tour under the supervision of a level 3 or 4 senior engineer.  With the Frigates being the most common UPF capital ship, I'd expect that a lot of new officers do their first tour there.

That being said, I like your crew breakdowns.
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 24, 2009 - 7:16am
I was keeping with a large engineering department figuring that there is bound to be a lot of upkeep and repair work that is constant plus I've been heavily influence by David weber novels and I see the chief engineer being a department head with shift supervisors plus those who are supervised.With a large engineering department a engine overhaul would be greatly speeded which may not be critical for a civilian ship but could be very important to a military ship.
I also assumed that robotics would fall within their domain.

I could drop this to 5 but I really like 7 or 6 where there is someone in charge of a shift and their staff which would seem funny if it was just 1 so: 2 enlisted and a CPO or ensign (to supervise) and a LT to head the department.

Marines detachment do what marines do.

services anything from cooking to hair cutting (just cant see too many people letting a robot cut their hair)

Weapons and gun crews with a gunnery officer and his assistant (also a junior officer or an ensign) the crews could easily be enlisted with the responsibility to train and do maintenance on their weapons moving reloads from stores or the magazines to rearm the rocket battery and torps.
The actual gunners on a ship are fairly redundant at the start of a battle as all weapons would be tied into the Chief gunners station and essentially fired from there with computer support. once battle damage accrues the situation could arise that the guns are forced to be fired by the on mount crews. In theory, for this game, that would only require 1 crew. but it feels better to have more so I see the marines filling out gun crews.

Also I need to bring up the medical department - from quizzing friends with military exp. they all said my medical department is way over staffed. and US nuclear subs were sited as a comparison to a 30 crew frigate where the medical department on a sub is just a medic- albeit one with major training in trauma medicine and since the crew of a sub is for the most part very healthy and fit 1 medic should be enough. After thinking about it I have to say that Dr. McCoy from star trek and the novel "On Basilisk Station" both figured prominently in my thinking for this department.

So should I take a cue from the US navy and make it a medic? or should be keep with the Science Fiction tradition of you have to have a Dr.? I could see it going either way. For a militia ship that doesn't leave its system they could easily dispense with the doctor as a medic could freeze field anyone too messed up for him to deal with till the ship put into port.

I like the tradition of ensigns being officers in larvae stage (big fan of Forester, Sloop of War series, and Honor Harrington series) so having 2-4 overworked ensigns that fill slots as officers but get crammed together in a 4 berth cabin is something I'm pretty stuck on as it reduces the number of officer cabins on the deck plan.

I also would like to keep the number of officers down compared to enlisted. To that end I'd like to designate departments that are run by an officer and staffed with a mix of CPOs and ratings and ensigns.
This is why I kept trying to lump communications into astro as one department - the astrogator is only busy while working up a jump at other time what's he do? I easily see him running a department that is responsible for scan, navigation and communication.

So heres the list of departments:
1. Command
2. Helm
3. Astro & Scan
4. Weapons
5. Medical
6. Engineering
7. Marines
8. Services

Do we really need a Communications officer? If there was more to the jaming and electronic warfare aspect to these rule then I'd say a have a com/EW officer but then the chief gunner is by default a EW officer since his mission is to lock up an enemy vessel by peering through the ECM.
I suppose the com officer could be responsible for defending the ship and degrading the enemy's fire with jamming and ECM. If we allow for a house rule of jamming, ECM, & ECCM then the com officer would run the jamming & screens, his skill gennerating a -% to enemy targeting of direct fire weapons, the assit. gunner would handle active defences like point defence (interceptor missiles). Maybe the com officer should be the gunner's assistant?

Any thoughts?
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
February 18, 2009 - 4:57am
http://upffrigate.20m.com/

I just finished that one up tonight, recycling a fair amount of the destroyer stuff but I'm happy with it. My old hand-drawn maps were also pretty similar so it goes hand in hand with the remakes.
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

Anonymous's picture
w00t (not verified)
February 18, 2009 - 8:02am
SS,

What "stands out" between the Destroyer and the Frigate?

Also, hope you don't mind, I redrew your destroyer using Word image tools which I was going to submit along with your submission for Issue 11. coo?

UPFD (Thumbnail, not yet complete)




Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
February 18, 2009 - 7:32pm

I made them as similar designs based on the overview of the KH Campaign Book on pp. 6-7...if you look there both are very similar with the destryoer having a longer neck to satisfy the larger hull size requirements. I then amalgated those profiles with the die cast minis that were available back in the day. Since the destroyer and frigate minis were as different as night and day, I blended all three styles using the frigate's four mid section wedges as a gunnery platform (which is one interpretation of the KH profiles), the destroyer's bridge (I really dig that flat hexagonal shape), and then added some Gullwind tail design to it all for a more believable drive profile (the frigate mini and KH profiles look like inboard mounted chemical drives on both).


As for what stands out between the two...everything is larger on the destroyer but like the KH pp6-7 profile it's the long neck that distinguishes it from the frigate. The KH book states that the destroyers are not a mainstay and is an unpopular design for the UPF, due to the frigate being nearly identical in firepower but faster. Which is certainly plausible, but I wanted to make the destroyer attractive as well so I went with the premise that they can take a better beating (with 10 extra HP) and that electron gun can really shine when it comes to hitting the "unhitable" targets via the longer range and better chance to hit over a LB against reflective hulls and masking screens (the most common defenses)...it really is an advantageous weapon system.

I'm still working on the alternate types, trying to balance it better. Feel free to leave out all the FE stuff for the SFman if you will (the extra deckplan on the destoyer page and the alternate gun profile on the gunnery deck graphic, as well as the stats) as it is still subject to change...and I just edited the crew quarters/gunnery deck to add a laundry room.

I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

jedion357's picture
jedion357
December 9, 2011 - 7:05am
Shadow Shack wrote:
P.S. I have no issue on two drives...I figure the KH chart is pretty wrong in that respect anyways seeing as HS:5 & 6 craft call for 3 B drives and larger 7 & 8 hulls only need two B drives. Certainly a military ship would get away with streamlined stats even going by the canon chart.

 

Could it be that the chart was suppose to say three type A engines as the next progression up in hulls from two type A engines for HS3-4? Then HS7-8 make sense having two type B engines. Perhaps its just a type O

I just looked over the chart and this works if HS 5-6 are downgraded to type A engines. Other than an odd listing of 4 type C engines for HS 19 when HS 16-18 has 6 type C and HS20 has 8 type C, so I'd change the listing for HS 19 as well.

I think with these changes I'd house rule that a ship could drop one engine mount if it upgraded all the other engine mounts to the next size up. So a frigate or destroyer could go with 2 type B's instead of 3 type A's
I think I'd also allow a long range HS 3 scout to mount one type B (it could make 3 jumps without overhaul)
or it could mount 2 type b's and make 6 jumps before an overhaul (it only needs 1 type B but since it mounts 2 its engines are only working 1/2 as much so they get double the performance)

Likewise a frigate under this house rule would only need 3 type A or two type B but if it had four type B engines, doubling the total number it needs of that type it doubles the number of jumps before an overhaul making it 6 jumps.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
December 10, 2011 - 11:17am
That would certainly be plausible if not for the rule that states A drives are for HS:1-4 craft and B drives for HS:5-15.
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 30, 2012 - 6:53am
How many reloads would a frigate have stored?

Book says it has BR x4, Torp X2, ICM x4 This is the ordinance that is ready to fire in combat but I assume that is has some reloads that can be moved into the weapon's magazines.

So what do we think a reasonable number of reloads would be?

While on the subject how much extra fuel would a frigate with size B engines have?
Size B engines hold 6 atomic pellets and a frigate needs three drives. so one complete reload would be 18 pellets.

UPDATE: going to try to rework my deck plans in CC3 software
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
January 30, 2012 - 11:00am
If you want the ships to carry their own reloads, then I'd say they carry two complete reloads for their weapons.  As for fuel, I go with one complete refill for the ships will class B or C engines and two for the Class A engine ships.  So basically, enough fuel for at least six more jumps over their initial compliment.  That should allow you to get almost anywhere in the Frontier to pick up more supplies if needed.

Another idea is to have "ammo ships"/"oilers"/tenders as part of the fleet structure.  Basically a small- to mid-sized freighter (HS 5-7) that has an ADF of 3 that flies along to provide reloads but stays well out of the way during combat.  Once the battle is over, the fleet meets up with the oiler and tranfers the reloads over.  In that case you can carry quite a bit of extra ordanance and fuel for the fleet.  In addition, these ship can carry extra engineers that can transfer over to the ships as needed to help with post battle damage repair if necessary or just help speed up engine overhauls and general maintenance on a routine basis.

I think I need to do a ship design.

Adventure idea.  PC's are part of the crew on an oiler.  The small task force they are assigned to (destroyer, frigate and two assault scouts) take off to repond to a pirate attack.  However, the attack, while real, is a decoy to draw the combat ships out.  The real goal of the pirates is to take the oiler and pilfer its supplies.  The ship is up against a pair or trio of corvettes and armed only with its dual laser batteries.  Start with a KH battle as the pirates try to disable the oiler's engines and then shift to close combat as they try to repel the boarders.  That might be a fun scenario to do for the Con.
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jedion357's picture
jedion357
January 30, 2012 - 12:37pm
I think fleet tender or possibly collier, which was used, IIRC, by David Weber even though the word means a ship that carries coal. Personally I like collier over tender but both work. Oiler has the wrong sound for a space ship IMO. I think the collier would have a large compliment of work pods as well as a new kind of pod called a cargo pod with heavy duty arms and clamps to facilitate speedy transfer of cargo.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
January 30, 2012 - 1:08pm
My frigate deck plans depict a hold, so it stands to reason any additional rocket salvoes and fuel could be stowed as such.

I also incorporate supply vessels in my game, HS:5-6 craft that ferry reloads and fuel with a fleet. At the same time they have repair docks (meaning cargo arms and workpods) to assist damaged vessels with repair work. The ship was initially designed to assist fighter squadrons on deep space patrol missions, but was later adapted to fleet maneuvers.
I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide...nor do I have any qualms stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

Jaxon's picture
Jaxon
August 7, 2013 - 8:56am
The rules state a frigate has a crew of 25 -30. Based on this I provide the following:

Officers: (7) Captain, Executive Officer, Navigator, Chief Engineer, Chief Medical Officer, Gunnery Officer (Energy), Gunnery Officer (Rocket)

Crew: (18) Pilot, Copilot, Communications Analyst, [2] Energy Analyst, [2] Rocket Analyst, [2] Defense Analyst, Computer Analyst, Robotics Analyst, Medic, [2] Cook, [2] Engineer, [2] Maintenance Crewman

Security: (5) Sergeant of Arms, [4] Marines

Robots: 1, Service, 3 Maintenance, 4 Security, 4 Combat

CO & XO split shifts, as do the Navigator Commo Analyst (both can run comms, radar, WNB). The Chief Engineer splits his shift between 2 Engineers & 1 Maintenance robots. The Maintenance Techs perform routine maintenance. Gunnery Officer are part of the crew and not Marine detachment. But, the detachment is small - 5 men. They were beefed up with 4 Security and 4 Combat robots. Pilot & Copilot split the shifts like the CO & XO. The crew for the weapons are just enough but, we all hands are called on deck, it does not matter if you are on or off shift. 1 Computer and 1 Robot specialist. There is 1 medic to work with the Medical officer and 2 cooks to work 2 shifts feeding 30 men. Finally, one Service robot. It could perform in the Rec Center, Laundry or even the CO's steward. I think this works. 7 officers to 23 crewman.

If you look at the stats for the CMS Leo it is 6 Officers, 28 crew and 15 Marines for a frigate = 49 crewman. That's the size of a destroyer. If you cram them together and use both lifesupport, it will work for a short time. Then again, the CMS does not leave it's berth much.

Finally, credit to Shadow for the deckplan.

jedion357's picture
jedion357
August 7, 2013 - 3:42pm
Jaxon wrote:
.

Finally, credit to Shadow for the deckplan.


The two of you should submit the frigate write up and deck plans to the Frontier Explorer. Looks like good work.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!