Spaceship hatch locks

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 13, 2016 - 11:37am
"Characters must decide what types and levels of locks they install on their own ships." (KH 38)

Is there anyplace where costs for these locks is discussed? I can't find one.
Comments:

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 13, 2016 - 12:19pm
I couldn't find anything in either KH or AD.  Zebulon has rules for locks and the costs are in the Equipment Tables at the back.

Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
June 14, 2016 - 12:06am
Yeah there's nothing in the canon boxed sets detailing this beyond defeating them with the Tech skill. I simply house-ruled that the Installation Security program must be at least as high in level as the desired locks & security systems, meaning a lv-4 program can only accomodate up to lv-4 locks, if you want the lv-6 locks you need the lv-6 program.
No, I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide. Nor do I have any qualms in stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

jedion357's picture
jedion357
June 14, 2016 - 8:57am
I use the Zebs locks and in particular the baton keys as a strap on for AD & KHs. Besides a colored transparent rod as a key is very sci-fi-ish. 
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 14, 2016 - 11:47am
^As a point of curiosity, are you aware of the possible reading of what you just said?

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 14, 2016 - 11:49am
Shadow Shack wrote:
I simply house-ruled that the Installation Security program must be at least as high in level as the desired locks & security systems

I don't think you'd need a program capable of coordinating all the security of an entire city just to put a fingerprint scanner on a door lock. I'd probably say that a lock is an independent device, and an installation security program simply lets you put all the locks of an area under computer control. The level of the installation security program is a measure not of lock complexity but of the complexity of the tasks that the computer needs to coordinate and analyze across all its security systems.

(Of course, there are no level 6 locks on spaceship hatches because it makes no sense to have fingerprint scanners or voice-pattern scanners in space!)

It looks like the costs of locks are completely down to handwavium.

TerlObar's picture
TerlObar
June 14, 2016 - 8:04pm
Time for someone to write an article. Smile
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Shadow Shack's picture
Shadow Shack
June 14, 2016 - 8:36pm
Stormcrow wrote:
Of course, there are no level 6 locks on spaceship hatches because it makes no sense to have fingerprint scanners or voice-pattern scanners in space!

True for the outer hull hatch, but it can be quite feasible for the inner hatch of that airlock and/or anything further inside. Which further hinders unwanted boarders that cut through the outer hatch and can no longer cycle the airlock as such. 


ChrisDonovan wrote:
^As a point of curiosity, are you aware of the possible reading of what you just said?

heh heh heh, huh huh...he said "stap on".

No, I'm not overly fond of Zeb's Guide. Nor do I have any qualms in stating why. Tongue out

My SF website

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 15, 2016 - 5:41am
Again, why not use the Zeb cost list?

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 15, 2016 - 6:47am
ChrisDonovan wrote:
Again, why not use the Zeb cost list?

I'm sorry, you seem to be referring to an unproduct. There is no such thing as a "Zeb cost list" and there never has been. All references to unproducts are treason, punishable by summary execution. Have a nice day!

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 15, 2016 - 6:59am
Of course, there are no level 6 locks on spaceship hatches because it makes no sense to have fingerprint scanners or voice-pattern scanners in space!

True for the outer hull hatch, but it can be quite feasible for the inner hatch of that airlock and/or anything further inside. Which further hinders unwanted boarders that cut through the outer hatch and can no longer cycle the airlock as such.

Actually, now that I look more closely at the Spaceship Security Table, I see that there are level 6 locks on spaceships, but the "other security devices at the hatch" never go above level 5.

At first I thought this was odd, but I've just looked back at the Opening Locks subskill in Alpha Dawn where it says, "The level of a lock usually is the same as the level of any nearby security devices, but the referee may change this." That's what's happening in the Spaceship Security Table. If a technician is trying to open, say, a Spacefleet battleship's hatch, he'll have to detect and deactivate a level 5 heat-sensitive security system and open a level 6 lock.

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 15, 2016 - 12:19pm
Ok, here's what I roughed together in about 45 min or so:

Mechanical vs Electronic
All locks are mechanical in that the lock physically restrains the means of access to the protected space.  When people refer to “mechanical” locks vs “electronic” ones, they are referrring to the key.  A mechanical key would be a piece of engraved/cut metal that is physically inserted into the lock to establish acess, or in the case of a combination lock, a physical dial or manual keypad that properly enables the lock to be opened.

The important part is that the lock depends on physical interaction within the mechanism to function.  This is something of a limitation beyond one or two factors of identification (see below), because each additional factor requires it's own physical mechanism.  This increases not only the size and physical complexity of the lock, but also slows the speed of access.  Lastly, there is an upper limit on how sophisticated such locks may be, given the practical restrictions on key size, number of pins/tublers within the lock, etc.

An electronic lock uses some sort of comupterization to release the lock mechanism. The operator inputs data that the lock compares to a list of authorized factors and if the data matches, the lock opens.  Electronic locks have the benefit of being able to access and utilize more and more sophicticated means of identification, such as scans and bio-prints (finger prints, voiceprints, retina patterns, etc).

Factors of Identification

A “factor of identification” is simply a means by which the lock is authorized to be openable:

Single-factor – uses one means of identifying whether the means of identification is valid.  A mechanical key, manually-dialed combination, an id-card swipe, or a bio-metric match would all be examples of single-factor locks.

Multi-factor – use two or more means of identifying valid access.  All of the means of identification must agree before the lock will open.  The number of means varies from lock to lock, as does sophistication. The more the number of means of identification required, the more secure the lock is.

Lock Levels
For simplicity's sake, the following scale does not address specific differences in factors of identidication, merely the level of sophistication of the total lock.  A few examples of types of lock appropriate to this level are also given.

Level 1 – simple, one-factor locks such as keylocks/combination locks (desks, lockers), generic swipe-card locks, and PIN-code locks.

Level 2
– higher-quality but still simple locks such as “pick resistant” keylocks or two-factor locks that do not depend on any sort of bio-metric factors (key plus PIN-code locks, etc).

Level 3 – multi-factor mechanical locks or electronic locks that requre one form of bio-metric verification (thumb, voice or retina-print)

Level 4 – multi-factor mechanical locks of high-quality (bank vaults, etc) or electronic locks that require two forms of bio-metric verification.  Mechnical locks become to unweildy for efficient use above this level.

Level 5 & 6– multi-factor electronic locks requiring more than two forms of bio-metric verification.

The “two-man rule”
Any lock system that requires two or more individuals with the correct keys to open may be treated as one level higher. (Maximum of L6.)

Costs

Mechanical locks – 50 credits/level (maximum of L4)
Electronic locks – 100 credits/level

jedion357's picture
jedion357
June 15, 2016 - 10:05pm
Would there be locks on air locks? 

Space is a hostile environment and it could easily be deadly to lock someone out. It's a common real world ordinance to have a crash bar on roof top doors to prevent people from being trapped on the roof. 

It also occurs to me the Chinese space station in the  movie Gravity was not portrayed as having a lock on the airlock. 

Just playing a little bit of devil's advocate here it.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 16, 2016 - 6:27am
jedion357 wrote:
Would there be locks on air locks?

In a sector full of pirates, corporate wars, and genocidal worms, all trying to board your ship, you bet there would be locks on every hatch of your spaceship!

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 16, 2016 - 8:07am
I would think that there would be locks, but that they ordinarily would be left disengaged for safety reasons while the ship was in the air. On the ground, they would be used to keep unwanted intruders out of the ship.

jedion357's picture
jedion357
June 16, 2016 - 9:47am
ChrisDonovan wrote:
I would think that there would be locks, but that they ordinarily would be left disengaged for safety reasons while the ship was in the air. On the ground, they would be used to keep unwanted intruders out of the ship.

So engagement of the locks would be done from the bridge. And at air lock. No doubt there is a manual override at the inside of the air lock.
I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers!

ChrisDonovan's picture
ChrisDonovan
June 16, 2016 - 10:41am
No doubt the Bridge could override any local airlock control.  Likewise there would be a "Manual Override" in the airlock itself that could bypass a Bridge lockout, but only as a last resort. Dave Bowman demonstrated the use of such an override in the movie 2001.

Stormcrow's picture
Stormcrow
June 16, 2016 - 11:01am
If a spaceship's computer has an installation security program, probably at least level 3, it will control all the hatch locks and their associated security systems. That doesn't prevent the hatch from being opened manually, provided the computer operator doesn't override the control.

If a ship's computer doesn't have an installation security program, then all hatches are manually operated only.

rattraveller's picture
rattraveller
June 16, 2016 - 1:35pm
In the book "Alien" (you might have heard of the movie), Ripley had a long mental narative about why the airlock door on the Nostromo had a sign that said, "Authorized Personel Only". All seven crew members were authorized to use the airlock and if someone who wasn't authorized wanted to use it then he or she would use it if they wanted to anyway.

Maybe if they had locks on the door they would not have needed the sign.
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