 September 29, 2010 - 7:44pm | Zebs timeline details 3 Dramune Wars, none of which seemed to last longer than 1 year The climax of Dramune Run details events that would qualify as on of these wars So the question is, which historic event is detailed in the module #1, #2 or #3? I'm about to delve into the module for details but thought I'd try to stir up discussion on this. My first thought is that Drumune Run the module makes more sense if there had already been at least 1 Dramune War prior to the events in the module. I also think that the large number of ships in each militia makes sense if there has already been some shooting between them. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 September 29, 2010 - 8:02pm | Agreed. I got the same impression from that background part in Dramune Run when it stated that 'tensions were already running high between Inner and Outer reach' (paraphrasing), so they probably should have Dramune War I dated prior to the module's timeline. My SF website izz: http://ragnarr.webs.com |
 September 29, 2010 - 8:52pm | Well, Zeb's Guide says that the Third Drammune War is fought in fy 61 which is the year given in the setting of the Drammune Run module. So I'd say it was the third one. I believe that is the only module that gives a date for it's events and they managed to match it up correctly in the Zeb's Guide timeline. I don't remember if the module says which of the Drammune wars the action precipitates but I agree, it couldn't be the first one. Ad Astra Per Ardua! My blog - Expanding Frontier Webmaster - The Star Frontiers Network & this site Founding Editor - The Frontier Explorer Magazine Managing Editor - The Star Frontiersman Magazine |
September 29, 2010 - 9:21pm | Dang, yer right. Shoulda checked my Zebs prior to posting. Taking a freighter to the Dramune system is gonna be a nail biter no matter how ya look at it. "Stay Alert! Trust No One! Keep Your Laser Pistol Handy! ...And thank you for flying Dramune Spacelines!" My SF website izz: http://ragnarr.webs.com |
September 30, 2010 - 4:30pm | Well, Zeb's Guide says that the Third Drammune War is fought in fy 61 which is the year given in the setting of the Drammune Run module. So I'd say it was the third one. I believe that is the only module that gives a date for it's events and they managed to match it up correctly in the Zeb's Guide timeline. I don't remember if the module says which of the Drammune wars the action precipitates but I agree, it couldn't be the first one. Shoot! I wanted it to be 2 as I had an idea for something neat with #3. Still digging into the module for details. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 October 3, 2010 - 3:38am | I believe that is the only module that gives a date for it's events and they managed to match it up correctly in the Zeb's Guide timeline. And considering how nothing else matches up in the least (modules versus Zeb timeline), that can only be chalked up to blind doo-dah dumb luck. Flip a coin a million times and you'll eventually call it right... |
 December 12, 2012 - 7:37pm | I dropped by this cause since doing the Zeb's for the megacorp project I keep running into these kind of errors or at least trying to rewrite things but with no details. So what are they fighting these wars over? If the module is the 3rd war, I mean that wasn't a war. That was Star Law calling in Spacefleet calling in militia for a literal police action. It lasted one battle and some mop up. That is not a war. Thinking these questions and the fact that these are the two least likely planets to go to war (Dralasites vs crooks and miners) I am thinking we need to rethink the whole idea of who these guys are. Here's my start: The Dralasites of Inner Reach are known for painting their skin in different colors to show their mood of the day. Very Cute mood ring Dralasites UNLESS you remember that at medieval Japanese court the court members wore up to six silk shirts with different length sleeves in different colors to show their mood of the day. Importance placed on which color was at which place in the row of sleeves. We are talking one of the most cutthroat and backstabbing of places an imperial court. Oh and guess who these guys where in charge of? The Samurai. So maybe they mood ring Dralasites is not that accurate. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 13, 2012 - 5:19am | Samurai dralasites with a bad attitude? Interesting. Who aggressively provoke conflict with the miners and mobsters of their neighboring planet? Interesting. Certainly more interesting then dralasite mood rings. I once created a dralasite school of martial arts called Fluidism but that is perhaps more suitable for calmer more philosophy oriented dralasites. I think its time for a more aggressive school of dralasite martial arts, one that could kill you 36 ways with just a paint brush. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
December 13, 2012 - 4:53pm | Ok after some indepth reading I find the SF book does not agree with the module. Minor thing but the module says Inner Reach is a mixed race planet with the original Dralasites having been outnumbered by immigrants as the centuries went by. Well you could do a majority minority thing something like a population fo 35% Dralasite, 20% Human, 20% Vrusk, 20% Yazirian and 5% other races. Also that the source of the conflict is differing philosophies. They started the same but those damned Outer Reachers gave up the free thinking ways and turned bad. Jeez just cause they didn't have a garden spot environment and had to struggle. What were they thinking? Meanwhile the pompous Inner Reachers barely send enough food for us to survive and demand four times the going rate in mined ores and robots for it. Blame the others for anything that goes wrong and boom another war. Strongly hinted that Inner Reach has a much bigger population (no stated) but Outer Reach has 20 million and lots and lots of robots. Apparently Outer Reach has the space ship building ability to since they have the better fleet. Also telling is that Inner Reach being the greater economic power has the greater influence with the UPF and can get Spacefleet to help them out when the shooting starts. Says something about the UPF Council Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 13, 2012 - 10:18pm | So what are they fighting these wars over?
Chukkahs. At least that's what the third one was all about. Yes it's a bit comical at first thought, but the chukkah is the Inner Reach planetary symbol per se. MalCo was illegally siezing them for their own pursuits (ixiol), it would be no different if Canadians or Mexicans started crossing the border to hunt bald eagles so they could make pillows out of their feathers. Not only were they harvesting chukkah brains into drugs, they returned to the chukkah homeworld to push that drug upon its citizens. As futile as a war on drugs can be --- as evidenced by the ongoing US stance --- it's yet another facet of the overall war. Suffice it to say the designated governmental leader of I.R. wasn't about to sweep such an illicit activity under the rug (re: Fast and Furious  ). And there were other tid bits over a period of twenty years, such as increased docking fees on Outer Reach stations and ports to disrupt trade, and an unholy alliance between the O.R. militia and a fleet of pirates. Oh yeah, and they annihilated a pair of UPF ships (the assault scout Dirk and frigate Melinda McCoy). That was the straw that broke the roller's back for the UPF detachment that was lingering in I.R. as a deterrent force but unable to act without proof of hostilities. |
December 14, 2012 - 4:27am | Well one thing they actually got right was the Third Dramune War cause then. The Malthar was not only a crime lord but leader of half of the Outer Reach Government. So to arrest him for pushing drugs they had to take out his military and invade his station. Sound familiar? No? OK here's a hint. Panama also @Jed been working on a list of religions of the Frontier, would like to add Fluidism to it. Can you give some more detail. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 14, 2012 - 4:50am | And therein lies the diference between AD/KH and Zebs - only one of them gets it right.  |
December 14, 2012 - 5:22am | @Jed been working on a list of religions of the Frontier, would like to add Fluidism to it. Can you give some more detail. SFman #15 "Opiate of the Osakar" Bonus creds for you if you recognize the origin of the title. it was a basic religion article to support a player playing an osakar since they all have their own religion. I tried to create religions that would be "native" to the Frontier so that it wouldn't be, "my osakar practices Catholicism, Mormonism, Islam, christian Science, or whatever" which might feel like someone was mocking the religion in question. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
December 21, 2012 - 8:48pm |
OK here is a basic outline on how things happened. Corrections and expansions would be appreciated. 165PF
First colonist establish settlement on Inner Reach 160PF
First colonist establish settlement on Outer Reach 140PF
Both colonies begin to accept colonists from races other than Dralasites 135PF
Trade between the two planets is made easier when a group of Dralasite
merchants known as the Malthar Trade Union establish a space station over Outer
Reach which acts as a place for miners and manufacturers from Outer Reach to
bring their wares and traders from Inner Reach can bring theirs, primarily
foodstuffs. 60PF
Most easy access mines on Outer Reach are played out. Small disputes over
remaining mines 55PF
Those who can afford it start to leave Outer Reach because of the way it is
becoming more and more hostile. Most settle on Inner Reach and begin to spread
their stories of the horrors they saw. 53PF
A number of small kingdoms and dictatorships begin to battle each other for control
of the last large mines 33PF
Inner Reach implements tough new immigration laws aimed mainly at Outer Reach
natives. This is primarily due to several of the battling Outer Reach powers
sending agents to Inner Reach for criminal activities and as fronts to assist
their side in acquiring weapons 12PF
The Styrigian nation emerges as the supreme power on Outer Reach and attempts
to take control of the trade between Inner and Outer Reach 10PF
the Styrigians finally give up contending for power with the Maltharian Confederation.
The two forces worked out a unique compromise. The Styrigians take control of
the planet’s surface, and the Maltharians took control of the space stations
orbiting Outer Reach. The two governments have cooperated peacefully ever since. 9PF
Inner and Outer Reach governments meet for the first time and attempt to work
out trade agreements. Both sides accuse the other of being completely
unreasonable 8PF
While some basic rules are established, mostly based on common trade rules much
is left to the honesty of the merchants. Both sides constantly accuse the other
of violations 1PF
The "Grand Meeting" of leaders of the four races takes place on
Morgaine's World 1FY
(Federation Year) The United Planetary Federation, a mutual defense
organization, is established 2FY
Following new policies set up by the UPF prices for Outer Reaches minerals and
manufactured goods go down. Meanwhile demand for Inner Reach’s agricultural goods
makes their products’ prices skyrocket. Complaints that Inner Reach is
attempting to starve Outer Reach are meet by complaints by Inner Reach over Outer
Reach’s constant violation of laws and trade policies. 5FY
The Dome Crash Incident What happened was a system ship trader carrying
a large food shipment from Inner Reach crashed into one of the smaller domed
cities on Outer Reach killing all aboard the ship and several thousand in the dome.
Whether you believe it was crashed deliberately into the dome by Inner Reach as
a warning to Outer Reach OR that pirates working for one of the Outer Reach
governments tried to hijack the trader and lost control of it, is still a
matter of debate 5FY
Inner Reach appoints commissions to investigate and sends delegates discuss
compensation payments to both Outer Reach governments. Outer Reach builds up an
Army and Navy while paying lip service to the Inner Reach delegates 6FY
The First Dramune War is fought 6FY
The first battle of the war is less a fight and more a Viking style raid. Outer
Reach sends a group of militia hidden inside ore carriers to Inner Reach. They
sack and loot one of the main warehousing areas. While escaping back to Outer
Reach, Inner Reach’s small Navy is routed by the larger Outer Reach Navy. 6FY
Raids continue as Inner Reach tries to organize a defense and sends for help to
the UPF 6FY
A Spacefleet contingent arrives after a delay caused by several factors, 1) UPF
not sure on the legalities of sending in Spacefleet and debating for several
months, 2) this being the first deployment post Sathar War and not having
Admiral Morgaine, many problems arise in organizing it, 3) Rumored bribing of
officials on all levels by Outer Reach to hold up the deployment 6FY
With the arrival of Spacefleet Outer Reach immediately ceases all hostile activities.
Months of investigations and UPF council meetings take place but little is
accomplished. Inner Reach builds up its militia both Army and Navy but never receives
any compensation from Outer Reach. Outer Reach still demands an apology from
Inner Reach over the Dome Crash Incident and their overreaction to Outer Reach’s
actions (calling in Spacefleet) 7FY
On the surface everything is back to normal between the two neighbors but the
tension when groups from Inner and Outer Reach meet is very clear. 36FY
The Second Dramune War is fought 61FY
The Third Dramune War is fought: See events in the Module The Dramune Run Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 22, 2012 - 8:16am | 135PF Trade between the two planets is made easier when a group of Dralasite merchants known as the Malthar Trade Union Are you suggesting the Malthar is well over 200 years old? The timeline lists 197 years worth of activity (not counting any activity prior to forming a trade union), that being the case he would have to be at the end of his lifespan in the module. I like the rest but suggesting the Malthar is around for the entire history is a bit much. More so considering he gets away at the end of the module...lending credibility to a future return rather than crawling off to die of old age. |
December 22, 2012 - 8:32am | I have to second Shadowshack on that. Plus i like the idea of the Malthar evolving over time. So being powerful enough to establish a trade union that far back seems counter intuitive to me ....unless we're getting Star Wars-ish and equating the name to the Hut title such that there were multiple Malthar in history since its the dralasite equiv to the mafia title "don". I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
December 22, 2012 - 11:05am | My take on the Malthar is that the leader of the Maltharians is known as "The Malthar" whether it is a single person or just the latest one to hold the dictatorship depends on how you like your bad guy. I kinda went with the whole Godfather thing. Going with the Star Wars thing: Jabba the Hutt is just one of the Hutts. Part of an organization or race was never sure. Replacements were just waiting down the line. Oh and the average lifespan of a Dralasite is 250 years. Figuring a dictator with bucket loads of money could hire the best medical care than yes Malthar as one being easy fits within the Star Frontiers game universe. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 22, 2012 - 4:08pm | I'm liking the idea of Malthar being dralasite for "the don" I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
December 22, 2012 - 6:36pm | As a title that can change hands, I have no problem. Yes, I know the average span is 250 years, hence my comment --- we have nearly 200 years of activity in that timeline if it's one guy, and even at the beginning of the timeline said "one guy" would not be starting his adult life with a guild...he'd have some history leading up to the guild, which suggests by the time the module is portrayed he would be nearing the end of said lifespan. I just didn't interpret the Malthar in Dramune Run to be old and decrepit, he uses a Hover Round because he's bloated and grotesquely overweight (meaning there's no way he'd live 250 years LOL). So as a title, it works. One person, not so much. As for the Hutts --- they're a species originally from Varl and immigrated to Nar Shaddaa when Varl was devastated by the collapse of one of the binary stars it orbitted. For whatever reason, they use their species as a title with their names, the equivalent of saying "I'm Bob the Human." |
December 23, 2012 - 4:58am | Ok so we are agreed that the Malthar is a title that changes hands (tentacles) and given the nature of the dictatorship this change is probably pretty violent. Also we can say that since Outer Reach is a multi-race planet that the Malthar does not have to be a Dralasite. I did not know what to do with the 2nd Dramune War but am now thinking something to do with a change in Malthar leadership. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
December 23, 2012 - 3:44pm | I did not know what to do with the 2nd Dramune War but am now thinking something to do with a change in Malthar leadership. Lots of credibility there, it could have been anything but a smooth transition. A sibling or subordinate who didn't care for the direction the current don/malthar was taking and stepped the aggression up accordingly. Personally, I'd keep it a dralasite thing though. Just my view, but as mentioned earlier the term could be a dralasite word and seeing as Dramune was founded by the blobs, I'd want to keep it in their realm. |
December 23, 2012 - 2:52pm | I agree with Shadow, keep Malthar as a dralasite term. SF fans will who have not followed this thread will have an expectation that the Malthar is dralasite. But coming cold to material that says he's a human will cause a mental WTF that stops them in their tracks. Its also likely that a human would simply use a human term. plus i just like the idea of Malthar is a dralasite term and it doesn't really matter what time period in history we're talking about, there will always be a Malthar. I might not be a dralasite, vrusk or yazirian but I do play one in Star Frontiers! |
 December 23, 2012 - 4:50pm | Way back I wrote of the dralasites retaining memories from their parent. They share memories and do basic education while they are still attached to their parent. Maybe it wasn't memories but impressions and feelings. I would have to look at the Core Four project and look for the dralasite reproduction thread. Anyway, this could be a piece of how the Mather passes on. A parent child dictatorship like North Korea. Really bad guy creates child really bad guy to take his place. If we really wanted to be gross we could say that the Mathar collects his own spores and saves them for when he is ready to accept spore. Thus he would be his own parent. He would be nearly a clone. -iggy |
December 23, 2012 - 5:14pm | Thinking the collecting your own spores would hold the same connotations as incest in human society. Of course a criminal would not care. Interesting idea here. Oh I did two tours in Korea first one in 86-87 when Kim Il-sung died. Loads of fun. Now his grandson is in charge. That is one country to base bad guys on. They are alot smarter then we give them credit for. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
January 2, 2013 - 6:25pm |
Here's how it went down. Of
course doing well is relative. The upper classes of Outer Reach lived very well
but the majority of the population was far below the standard of living for the
UPF. Both governments are very corrupt dictatorships where extensive bribes are
needed to accomplish anything. The discontent with the governments is a normal
situation but the recession accompanying the change in economy brought a much
greater amount of discontent. Into
this situation a cabal of the Maltharian Confederation and the Styrigian nation
lower ranking politicians formed a plan. Led by the child of the Malther they
waited until both government leaders were aboard a starship heading to a UPF
council meeting. They then arranged for a simultaneous attack on the Outer Reach
leaders ship and an Inner Sphere militia ship. The
Captain of the Inner Sphere militia ship had lost his family during a raid in
the first Dramune War. A Dralasite, it was a very vocal opponent of Outer Reach
and was known for stopping and searching Outer Reach ships. Although its
actions were usually justified the cabal had been playing up its actions to the
outrage of Outer Reach citizens. With
both ships destroyed the Outer Reach Militia escort ship that was supposed to
guard the leadership was partially damaged and broadcast a highly edited
version of the destruction of the two ships calling for assistance and revenge.
The population of Outer Reach was properly outraged and immediately called for
a new war. Strangely everything for a new war was ready and immediately
launched. The
population of Inner Reach was confused but much more ready for war this time.
Engagements took place in space and on both planets. Spacefleet intervened much
more quickly this time and both sides came to an agreement in only a few weeks.
Inner Reach agreed to pay some reparations and apologize for the actions of one
of their militia captains. They also agreed to no longer stop and search Outer
Reach destined ships. However the population of Inner Reach felt they had
defended themselves well and gave as good as they got. The
cabal having got everything they wanted agreed and immediately went back to
establish their power and infighting for position. The population of Outer
Reach felt a boost to their economy and the pride of righting a grave wrong
committed against them. The UPF and Spacefleet were glad it ended quickly and a
lasting agreement seemed to be reached. This was one war in which everyone was
satisfied with the outcome. Except for the dead but no one asked them. Sounds like a great job but where did you say we had to go? |
